USCF turn down a million$

Main

Date: 23 Jun 2008 10:58:25
From: Chess One
Subject: USCF turn down a million$

A cool million for girls, nothing for Denker boys?

announced this morning:

see:
http://susanpolgar.blogspot.com/2008/06/huge-sponsorship-deal-by-texas-tech.html

I suspect people will readily state their own opinions on this news without
much prompting - but the immediate issue for me is if Bill Goichberg has a
better deal up his sleeve? If not, then is USCF's need to keep control of
the Denker more important than putting a million into what USCF was
established to do in the first place - to promote the game?

Phil Innes

Date: 02 Jul 2008 01:36:37
From: help bot
Subject: Re: Title 9??

On Jul 2, 1:30 am, nobody <[email protected] > wrote:

> > Pinstripes? Wrong era. Frilly silken shirts
> > were worn with velour coats, trimmed with
> > contrasting solid color lapels, as I recall (but
> > then, it's been a very long time...).

> Yes, it must have been - where were you when Madonna started wearing her
> underwear on the outside & expressed an interest in chess?

Hmm... I may have been surfin' with the Beach
Boys, or possibly "getting down" to disco music
if that was in the '70s. Burn, baby, burn!

> but then I do feel that Paul was rather ahead
> of his time..

Admit it: you read the stories and believed
they were true, just as you believed in Santa
Claus and in the Tooth Fairy. It never even
occurred to those hacks that a man might
have small shoes, being small himself; it
just goes to show that memorizing opening
variations in no way reflects one's ability to
think rationally. Take that book that Mr.
Soltis wrote, for instance, in which he went
on and on about how much effort he put into
his careful selection of brilliant games-- pure
fiction, unless you believe him so weak as to
not be able to spot a simple Rook capture!

You see, what happens is that one hack
comes along and gets his "facts" wrong,
then his mess of a story is blindly copied
by succeeding hacks, like those who write
for Chess Lies magazine. Until a /real/
writer comes along, you get the same error
repeated, time and again. That's why we
need those blasted pedants-- they are the
only ones who can save us from the idiocy
of all those hacks who write garbage about
chess.

As for Paul Morphy being ahead of his
time, well, in what time would he not have
crushed everyone like chickens in the
road? He was a true master of the open
game, a fine tactician. His only weakness
was that I was not there to help him hone
his positional skills more. You see, lowly
patzers like Mr. Mongredien and Uncle
Fred were no good for such training; you
need someone who can play /real/ chess,
someone like me, or maybe Fritz. Many
of the players PM faced were what we
called in those days "Rook players",
meaning he could and should give them
Rook odds. When someone finally did
come along who could give PM a real
game, he refused to play-- and he wasn't
even writing anything about Shakespeare.
What a pity.

-- help bot

Date: 02 Jul 2008 15:30:03
From: nobody
Subject: Re: Title 9??

help bot wrote:
.
> Pinstripes? Wrong era. Frilly silken shirts
> were worn with velour coats, trimmed with
> contrasting solid color lapels, as I recall (but
> then, it's been a very long time...).

Yes, it must have been - where were you when Madonna started wearing her
underwear on the outside & expressed an interest in chess? but then I do
feel that Paul was rather ahead of his time..

Date: 01 Jul 2008 18:50:56
From: help bot
Subject: Re: Title 9??

On Jul 1, 8:53 pm, nobody <[email protected] > wrote:

> > And just how do you know what sort of underwear
> > he wore, eh? I think you've just revealed a bit more
> > about your personal life than we cared to know.

> Eh? just a minute while I fix my lipstick. Didn't I mention he wore the
> frilly stuff over his pinstripes, but the high-heels were a dead
> giveaway..

Pinstripes? Wrong era. Frilly silken shirts
were worn with velour coats, trimmed with
contrasting solid color lapels, as I recall (but
then, it's been a very long time...).

> > BTW, the common story about PM and women's
> > shoes was debunked long ago.

> Well, my spies informed me that Morphy had quite the fetish when it came
> to ladies shoes, indeed had quite a collection in his bedroom which he'd
> arrange in a circle & dance round Indian-fashion emitting the odd whoop
> & nakid too..

Oh, you've been reading Andy Soltis or
that kook Larry Evans again! The shoes
were *his own*; they were small because
his feet were small, and he was dancing
around because there were fire ants in
his socks (a little trick I used to play on
folks who beat me at chess). Those
whoops were merely cries of pain; after
what he did to me OTB, he was lucky I
didn't put water moccasins in his pants.
(One thing's for sure: I'll never play p-h3
as White, ever, EVER again.)

-- help bot

Date: 02 Jul 2008 10:53:42
From: nobody
Subject: Re: Title 9??

help bot wrote:
.
> And just how do you know what sort of underwear
> he wore, eh? I think you've just revealed a bit more
> about your personal life than we cared to know.

Eh? just a minute while I fix my lipstick. Didn't I mention he wore the
frilly stuff over his pinstripes, but the high-heels were a dead
giveaway..

> BTW, the common story about PM and women's
> shoes was debunked long ago.

Well, my spies informed me that Morphy had quite the fetish when it came
to ladies shoes, indeed had quite a collection in his bedroom which he'd
arrange in a circle & dance round Indian-fashion emitting the odd whoop
& nakid too..

nobody.

Date: 30 Jun 2008 22:58:39
From: help bot
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

On Jul 1, 12:49 am, "Ray Gordon, creator of the \"pivot\""
<[email protected] > wrote:

> >> FYI: There is no water on Mars; it's too cold
> >> there,

> > It's too cold on Mars for liquid water.

Liquid water? What other sort of water is
there, but liquid?

> > The discovery of water ice

Make up your mind, laddie: is it "water",
or is it "ice"? Or did you perhaps mean
"ice-water", which is a mixture of the two?

> > on Mars was very significant.

Indeed it was, for if one day we run out of
water to drink, we can simply fly to Mars
and get some by melting some ice.

> Only if it was cherry or watermelon.

Interesting that you picked two flavors
which reflect the color of Mars, as seen
from Earth. That was unexpected, since
you cannot even seem to tell the difference
between water and ice.

-- help bot

Date: 30 Jun 2008 22:43:33
From: help bot
Subject: Re: Title 9??

On Jun 25, 9:07 pm, nobody <[email protected] > wrote:

> > > Nor can we count Morphy, because after he left Chess, he was a
> > > competent and successful lawyer.

> > Is this true? I always read that Morphy was very unsuccessful as a
> > lawyer.

> > Nobody would hire him.

> Well, if you wander round in pink high-heels & ladies underwear - can
> you blame 'them'?..

And just how do you know what sort of underwear
he wore, eh? I think you've just revealed a bit more
about your personal life than we cared to know.

BTW, the common story about PM and women's
shoes was debunked long ago.

-- help bot

Date: 26 Jun 2008 11:07:22
From: nobody
Subject: Re: Title 9??

samsloan wrote:
>
> On Jun 25, 7:16 am, Quadibloc <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > Nor can we count Morphy, because after he left Chess, he was a
> > competent and successful lawyer.
> >
> > John Savard
>
> Is this true? I always read that Morphy was very unsuccessful as a
> lawyer.
>
> Nobody would hire him.

Well, if you wander round in pink high-heels & ladies underwear - can
you blame 'them'?..

Date: 26 Jun 2008 10:52:24
From: nobody
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

[email protected] wrote:
>
> OUR GERMAN BLOWHARD
>
> Apparently all this blowhard can do is belittle the efforts of those
> who are truly trying to promote the game he professes to love.
>
> J�rgen R. wrote:
>
> And what are all those critics like Juergen doing to promote chess --
>
>> Nothing. Nor do I intend to promote chess or anything else.
>> Not everyone shares the attitude that everything that pleases you must
>> be
>> advertised, promoted and sold.

A _valid_ point! Chess is just there, sooner or later 'it' will find you
or you will find 'it'. Did Capablanca or Morphy need to have 'it' thrust
down their throats? I think not. These so very involved, so very busy
'chessers' sometimes give me the very shits..

>
> > other than shooting off their mouths?
>
> > I was also informed that funds are available to pay the USCF
> > membership fee for players who can't afford it.
>
> If I can't afford the membership fee I surely can't afford to travel
> to Lubbock, TX.

Date: 25 Jun 2008 10:16:20
From: samsloan
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

On Jun 25, 12:52 pm, "Chess One" <[email protected] > wrote:
> "samsloan" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]...
>
>
>
> > On Jun 25, 9:40 am, "Chess One" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >> In the case of the Denker, we see refusal of substantial benefits to
> >> young
> >> men in chess, but with no comparison made with alternatives. The only
> >> arguments I have read here is on how this will effect USCF, rather than
> >> benefit young players. Those are the plain issues, worth public
> >> discussion -
> >> and if Denker committee is completely synonymous with USCF, then beyond
> >> praise or blame, let us all understand that.
>
> >> If CJA folks want to talk in place of Denker/USCF, are their opinions
> >> too,
> >> synonymous with those agencies? As represented here, they are. Which was
> >> my
> >> initial point!
>
> >> Phil Innes
>
> > The "benefits" to young men is that one player, the winner, gets a
> > scholarship to Texas Tech,
>
> I am asking with what the Texas Tech offer is //specifically// comparable
> with?
>
> > plus the players get to share a double
> > dormitory room and get to eat buffet style meals during the
> > tournament. To compete for this they have to travel to Lubbock Texas
> > at their own expense.
>
> > Meanwhile, the present Denker arrangement is that the winners receive
> > cash prizes awarded by Mitch Denker and can also play in the US Open.
>
> > Which deal is better?
>
> Which is how much? If you actually knew how much cash prizes currently were,
> surely you could have mentioned them?
>
> Then these two options could be compared. There is no need to get emotional
> over a simple competitive comparison.
>
> Phil Innes

I believe that when the prizes were announced at the last Denker in
Cherry Hill, the total of the prizes was about $5,000.

I can tell you that I would much rather get a $1000 first prize in
real money than receive a scholarship to Texas Tech University and no
money.

Sam Sloan

Date: 25 Jun 2008 14:18:47
From: Chess One
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

"samsloan" <[email protected] > wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

> I believe that when the prizes were announced at the last Denker in
> Cherry Hill, the total of the prizes was about $5,000.
>
> I can tell you that I would much rather get a $1000 first prize in
> real money than receive a scholarship to Texas Tech University and no
> money.
>
> Sam Sloan

Whereas, I believe these are the real comparsions:

The prize fund, sponsored by the Susan Polgar Foundation and the U.S. Chess
Trust, are $1,250 divided into four scholarship prizes: 1st ($500), 2nd
($300), 3rd ($250), and 4th ($200). These prizes are paid to the players
directly by the U.S. Chess Trust and the Susan Polgar Foundation, but only
upon receipt of proof of enrollment in a college, university, trade,
community, or technical school.

(The Denker structure is similar. There is no $5,000 prize. Each Denker
player receives $100 stipend which was the same as the Polgar. Last year,
the top 25 girls also got a wooden chess set, each is valued more than $120.
The winner got a $500 wooden set. The Denker did not get this. The Polgar
girls also got many more prizes and perks. This year, the Polgar girls also
get free room, meal, and many other chess prizes instead of the $100. The
Denker boys get to pay $120/night hotel x 6 nights, $50/food per day x 6
days, and $155 entry fees to the US Open if they choose to play in both.)

In addition, a $500 Ursula Foster scholarship is also awarded to the highest
finisher under the age of 14. The scholarship is divided in the case of a
tie.

Phil Innes

Date: 26 Jun 2008 10:33:52
From: nobody
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

Chess One wrote:
.

>$50/food per day x 6
> days,

What, are they pigs or something? I heard food was relatively cheap in
the US. I figure they could get by on $15 - $20 per day - easy..

Date: 25 Jun 2008 17:55:29
From: Brian Lafferty
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

samsloan wrote:
> On Jun 25, 12:52 pm, "Chess One" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> "samsloan" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>
>> news:[email protected]...
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Jun 25, 9:40 am, "Chess One" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>> In the case of the Denker, we see refusal of substantial benefits to
>>>> young
>>>> men in chess, but with no comparison made with alternatives. The only
>>>> arguments I have read here is on how this will effect USCF, rather than
>>>> benefit young players. Those are the plain issues, worth public
>>>> discussion -
>>>> and if Denker committee is completely synonymous with USCF, then beyond
>>>> praise or blame, let us all understand that.
>>>> If CJA folks want to talk in place of Denker/USCF, are their opinions
>>>> too,
>>>> synonymous with those agencies? As represented here, they are. Which was
>>>> my
>>>> initial point!
>>>> Phil Innes
>>> The "benefits" to young men is that one player, the winner, gets a
>>> scholarship to Texas Tech,
>> I am asking with what the Texas Tech offer is //specifically// comparable
>> with?
>>
>>> plus the players get to share a double
>>> dormitory room and get to eat buffet style meals during the
>>> tournament. To compete for this they have to travel to Lubbock Texas
>>> at their own expense.
>>> Meanwhile, the present Denker arrangement is that the winners receive
>>> cash prizes awarded by Mitch Denker and can also play in the US Open.
>>> Which deal is better?
>> Which is how much? If you actually knew how much cash prizes currently were,
>> surely you could have mentioned them?
>>
>> Then these two options could be compared. There is no need to get emotional
>> over a simple competitive comparison.
>>
>> Phil Innes
>
> I believe that when the prizes were announced at the last Denker in
> Cherry Hill, the total of the prizes was about $5,000.
>
> I can tell you that I would much rather get a $1000 first prize in
> real money than receive a scholarship to Texas Tech University and no
> money.
>
> Sam Sloan

What's wrong with a third tier university (US News and Work Report
rankings) in Texas, in the middle of nowhere? Some people might like it
and be thrilled to win a scholarship there.

Date: 01 Jul 2008 00:51:47
From: Ray Gordon, creator of the \pivot\
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

>>>>> In the case of the Denker, we see refusal of substantial benefits to
>>>>> young
>>>>> men in chess, but with no comparison made with alternatives. The only
>>>>> arguments I have read here is on how this will effect USCF, rather
>>>>> than
>>>>> benefit young players. Those are the plain issues, worth public
>>>>> discussion -
>>>>> and if Denker committee is completely synonymous with USCF, then
>>>>> beyond
>>>>> praise or blame, let us all understand that.
>>>>> If CJA folks want to talk in place of Denker/USCF, are their opinions
>>>>> too,
>>>>> synonymous with those agencies? As represented here, they are. Which
>>>>> was
>>>>> my
>>>>> initial point!
>>>>> Phil Innes
>>>> The "benefits" to young men is that one player, the winner, gets a
>>>> scholarship to Texas Tech,
>>> I am asking with what the Texas Tech offer is //specifically//
>>> comparable
>>> with?
>>>
>>>> plus the players get to share a double
>>>> dormitory room and get to eat buffet style meals during the
>>>> tournament. To compete for this they have to travel to Lubbock Texas
>>>> at their own expense.
>>>> Meanwhile, the present Denker arrangement is that the winners receive
>>>> cash prizes awarded by Mitch Denker and can also play in the US Open.
>>>> Which deal is better?
>>> Which is how much? If you actually knew how much cash prizes currently
>>> were,
>>> surely you could have mentioned them?
>>>
>>> Then these two options could be compared. There is no need to get
>>> emotional
>>> over a simple competitive comparison.
>>>
>>> Phil Innes
>>
>> I believe that when the prizes were announced at the last Denker in
>> Cherry Hill, the total of the prizes was about $5,000.
>>
>> I can tell you that I would much rather get a $1000 first prize in
>> real money than receive a scholarship to Texas Tech University and no
>> money.
>>
>> Sam Sloan
>
>
> What's wrong with a third tier university (US News and Work Report
> rankings) in Texas, in the middle of nowhere? Some people might like it
> and be thrilled to win a scholarship there.

A full scholarship to Texas Tech is nothing to dismiss so blithely.

That's very valuable objectively, and it's not a bad school. Those rankings
juggle every year anyway, and are not program-specific.

Even the "worst" schools usually have one department that's above all
others. The University at Boca Raton, for example, has a great mortuary
science program that is run as if it were at Harvard.

--
--
Ray Gordon, The ORIGINAL Lifestyle Seduction Guru

Finding Your A-Game:
http://www.cybersheet.com/library.html
Includes 29 Reasons Not To Be A Nice Guy (FREE!)
The book Neil Strauss and VH-1 STOLE The Pivot From

Click HERE: for the ORIGINAL pivot chapter:
http://www.cybersheet.com/pivot.pdf

Here's my Myspace Page: And Pickup Blog (FREE advice)
http://www.myspace.com/snodgrasspublishing

Don't rely on overexposed, mass-marketed commercial seduction methods which
no longer work. Learn the methods the gurus USE with the money they make
from what they teach.

Thinking of taking a seduction "workshiop?" Read THIS:
http://www.dirtyscottsdale.com/?p=1187

Beware! VH-1's "The Pickup Artst" was FRAUDULENT. Six of the eight
contestants were actors, and they used PAID TARGETS in the club. The paid
targets got mad when VH-1 said "there are no actors in this club" and ruined
their prromised acting credit. What else has Mystery lied about?

Date: 25 Jun 2008 08:10:36
From: samsloan
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

On Jun 25, 9:40 am, "Chess One" <[email protected] > wrote:

> In the case of the Denker, we see refusal of substantial benefits to young
> men in chess, but with no comparison made with alternatives. The only
> arguments I have read here is on how this will effect USCF, rather than
> benefit young players. Those are the plain issues, worth public discussion -
> and if Denker committee is completely synonymous with USCF, then beyond
> praise or blame, let us all understand that.
>
> If CJA folks want to talk in place of Denker/USCF, are their opinions too,
> synonymous with those agencies? As represented here, they are. Which was my
> initial point!
>
> Phil Innes

The "benefits" to young men is that one player, the winner, gets a
scholarship to Texas Tech, plus the players get to share a double
dormitory room and get to eat buffet style meals during the
tournament. To compete for this they have to travel to Lubbock Texas
at their own expense.

Meanwhile, the present Denker arrangement is that the winners receive
cash prizes awarded by Mitch Denker and can also play in the US Open.

Which deal is better?

Sam Sloan

Date: 25 Jun 2008 12:52:51
From: Chess One
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

"samsloan" <[email protected] > wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Jun 25, 9:40 am, "Chess One" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> In the case of the Denker, we see refusal of substantial benefits to
>> young
>> men in chess, but with no comparison made with alternatives. The only
>> arguments I have read here is on how this will effect USCF, rather than
>> benefit young players. Those are the plain issues, worth public
>> discussion -
>> and if Denker committee is completely synonymous with USCF, then beyond
>> praise or blame, let us all understand that.
>>
>> If CJA folks want to talk in place of Denker/USCF, are their opinions
>> too,
>> synonymous with those agencies? As represented here, they are. Which was
>> my
>> initial point!
>>
>> Phil Innes
>
> The "benefits" to young men is that one player, the winner, gets a
> scholarship to Texas Tech,

I am asking with what the Texas Tech offer is //specifically// comparable
with?

> plus the players get to share a double
> dormitory room and get to eat buffet style meals during the
> tournament. To compete for this they have to travel to Lubbock Texas
> at their own expense.
>
> Meanwhile, the present Denker arrangement is that the winners receive
> cash prizes awarded by Mitch Denker and can also play in the US Open.
>
> Which deal is better?

Which is how much? If you actually knew how much cash prizes currently were,
surely you could have mentioned them?

Then these two options could be compared. There is no need to get emotional
over a simple competive comparison.

Phil Innes

> Sam Sloan

Date: 25 Jun 2008 04:32:36
From: samsloan
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

On Jun 25, 7:01 am, Quadibloc <[email protected] > wrote:
>
> This is true. But I can at least understand that it might be thought
> that a t of a scholarship at a particular college *by* that college
> is advertising for that college - bought cheaply, because the odds of
> it being redeemed might be too low.
>
> John Savard

Good point. How many people had ever heard of Texas Tech University,
other than having a football team and a basketball team, before this
thing started?

Texas Tech is certainly getting a lot of advertising at very low cost.

Sam Sloan

Date: 25 Jun 2008 15:33:27
From: Ray Gordon, creator of the \pivot\
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

Actually the donor gets a tax deduction if the scholarships are funded by a
third party.

I suspect they will be cashed in, as a college education is worth six
figuers and up now.

It was $2k a semester for SUNY in 1985 when I started. Sick.

--
--
Ray Gordon, The ORIGINAL Lifestyle Seduction Guru

Finding Your A-Game:
http://www.cybersheet.com/library.html
Includes 29 Reasons Not To Be A Nice Guy (FREE!)
The book Neil Strauss and VH-1 STOLE The Pivot From

Click HERE: for the ORIGINAL pivot chapter:
http://www.cybersheet.com/pivot.pdf

Here's my Myspace Page: And Pickup Blog (FREE advice)
http://www.myspace.com/snodgrasspublishing

Don't rely on overexposed, mass-marketed commercial seduction methods which
no longer work. Learn the methods the gurus USE with the money they make
from what they teach.

Thinking of taking a seduction "workshiop?" Read THIS:
http://www.dirtyscottsdale.com/?p=1187

Beware! VH-1's "The Pickup Artst" was FRAUDULENT. Six of the eight
contestants were actors, and they used PAID TARGETS in the club. The paid
targets got mad when VH-1 said "there are no actors in this club" and ruined
their prromised acting credit. What else has Mystery lied about?

Date: 25 Jun 2008 09:48:48
From: johnny_t
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

samsloan wrote:

>
> Texas Tech is certainly getting a lot of advertising at very low cost?

Careful Sam. You might figure out what Public Relations *is*.

Date: 25 Jun 2008 04:29:01
From: samsloan
Subject: Re: Title 9??

On Jun 25, 7:16 am, Quadibloc <[email protected] > wrote:

> Nor can we count Morphy, because after he left Chess, he was a
> competent and successful lawyer.
>
> John Savard

Is this true? I always read that Morphy was very unsuccessful as a
lawyer.

Nobody would hire him.

Sam Sloan

Date: 25 Jun 2008 04:16:53
From: Quadibloc
Subject: Re: Title 9??

On Jun 23, 11:08 am, "Ray Gordon, creator of the \"pivot\""
<[email protected] > wrote:

> The value of chess as an education al tool is dubious. For every mind is
> sharpens, it seems to waste others with unhealthy addictions to the game,
> often fueled by the quasi-academic legitimacy the "sport" gets.

It has been argued that Chess is dangerous, and it is true that a
number of top-level Grandmasters have ended up badly.

I think, however, the number of 12-year-olds who are kept off the
streets by Chess (minds it sharpens) is _much_ greater than the number
of people who were driven insane by Chess - almost always top
Grandmasters, often World Champions - and who actually showed signs of
being talented in fields other than Chess (minds it wastes).

Thus, one can't count R. J. Fischer as a mind wasted by Chess - as far
as anyone knows, if it wasn't for Chess, he would have been a complete
nobody. Nor can we count Morphy, because after he left Chess, he was a
competent and successful lawyer.

John Savard

Date: 25 Jun 2008 04:09:10
From: Quadibloc
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

On Jun 24, 5:13 pm, help bot <[email protected] > wrote:

> FYI: There is no water on Mars; it's too cold
> there,

It's too cold on Mars for liquid water. The discovery of water ice on
Mars was very significant. It's true that in ordinary parlance, water
refers to only the liquid phase of the compound, and "ice" always
refers to water ice, but in other contexts, water is simply H2O... and
frozen carbon dioxide and frozen methane are other examples of ices.

John Savard

Date: 01 Jul 2008 00:49:14
From: Ray Gordon, creator of the \pivot\
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

>> FYI: There is no water on Mars; it's too cold
>> there,
>
> It's too cold on Mars for liquid water. The discovery of water ice on
> Mars was very significant.

Only if it was cherry or watermelon.

--
--
Ray Gordon, The ORIGINAL Lifestyle Seduction Guru

Finding Your A-Game:
http://www.cybersheet.com/library.html
Includes 29 Reasons Not To Be A Nice Guy (FREE!)
The book Neil Strauss and VH-1 STOLE The Pivot From

Click HERE: for the ORIGINAL pivot chapter:
http://www.cybersheet.com/pivot.pdf

Here's my Myspace Page: And Pickup Blog (FREE advice)
http://www.myspace.com/snodgrasspublishing

Don't rely on overexposed, mass-marketed commercial seduction methods which
no longer work. Learn the methods the gurus USE with the money they make
from what they teach.

Thinking of taking a seduction "workshiop?" Read THIS:
http://www.dirtyscottsdale.com/?p=1187

Beware! VH-1's "The Pickup Artst" was FRAUDULENT. Six of the eight
contestants were actors, and they used PAID TARGETS in the club. The paid
targets got mad when VH-1 said "there are no actors in this club" and ruined
their prromised acting credit. What else has Mystery lied about?

Date: 25 Jun 2008 04:03:19
From: Quadibloc
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

On Jun 25, 4:22 am, J=FCrgen R. <[email protected] > wrote:

> In August 1951, a v-shaped formation of lights was seen over the city. Th=
e
> "Lubbock Lights" series of sightings received national publicity and is
> regarded as one of the first great UFO cases. The sightings were consider=
ed
> credible because they were witnessed by several respected science profess=
ors
> at Texas Technological College and were photographed by a Texas Tech
> student. The photographs were reprinted nationwide in newspapers and in L=
IFE
> magazine. Project Blue Book, the US Air Force's official study of the UFO
> mystery, did an extensive investigation of the Lubbock Lights. They
> concluded that the photographs were not a hoax and showed genuine objects=
.

Indeed. But the v-shaped formation of the lights was consistent with
the genuine objects simply being the members of a flock of birds
migrating, reflecting the streetlamps below.

John Savard

Date: 25 Jun 2008 04:01:30
From: Quadibloc
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

On Jun 24, 11:18 am, "Chess One" <[email protected] > wrote:

> The going rate for advertising what benefits especially young chess players
> at Chessville is $0. We don't charge for that, we exist to promote that.

This is true. But I can at least understand that it might be thought
that a t of a scolarship at a particular college *by* that college
is advertising for that college - bought cheaply, because the odds of
it being redeemed might be too low.

That might not be a fair characterization of the offer, and the USCF
might be making a mistake. But I can see there's another side to this
story.

John Savard

Date: 25 Jun 2008 03:17:16
From: samsloan
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

On Jun 25, 5:06 am, samsloan <[email protected] > wrote:

> How much does the Motel 6 in Lubbock Texas cost?
>
> Sam Sloan

Actually, I decided to look it up and answer my own question.

The Motel 6 in Lubbock Texas costs at that time of year costs $41.99

Motel 6 Lubbock #298
909 66th Street
I-27 at 66th Street, Exits #1/1-B
Lubbock, TX, 79412
Phone: (806) 745-5541

Date: 25 Jun 2008 02:06:14
From: samsloan
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

I am just wondering about the math. The Polgar blogspot says:

"Last year, Texas Tech University generously agreed to host the Susan
Polgar National Invitational for Girls, the most prestigious all-girls
event in the United States, for the next 10 years and award a four-
year academic scholarship for the winner each year to attend TTU. That
is nearly an $800,000 sponsorship package."

http://susanpolgar.blogspot.com/2008/06/huge-sponsorship-deal-by-texas-tech.html

Since the event was never held before in this format, I am wondering
how it became "the most prestigious all-girls event in the United
States".

Now, according to my math, if the winner for each of the next ten
years gets an $80,000 scholarship, this means that the tuition at
Texas Tech is $20,000 per year. Is this correct?

Also, the offer has increased to "One million dollars" by giving
dormitory rooms and cafeteria food vouchers to the players and also
the parents only have to pay $22 per day. Since the event lasts 6
days, that still sounds like $132 according to my math.

How much does the Motel 6 in Lubbock Texas cost?

Sam Sloan

Date: 25 Jun 2008 00:58:13
From: [email protected]
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

OUR GERMAN BLOWHARD

Apparently all this blowhard can do is belittle the efforts of those
who are truly trying to promote the game he professes to love.

J=FCrgen R. wrote:

And what are all those critics like Juergen doing to promote chess --

Nothing. Nor do I intend to promote chess or anything else.
Not everyone shares the attitude that everything that pleases you must
be
advertised, promoted and sold.

> other than shooting off their mouths?

> I was also informed that funds are available to pay the USCF
> membership fee for players who can't afford it.

If I can't afford the membership fee I surely can't afford to travel
to Lubbock, TX.

Date: 25 Jun 2008 13:11:40
From: Ray Gordon, creator of the \pivot\
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

Don't know about you, but I used to coach a high school team as a volunteer,
and I would play and teach many coffeehouse players who otherwise wouldn't
have been exposed to chess theory.

That was before I viewed chess as one step above being a racetrack
degenerate. of course.

--
--
Ray Gordon, The ORIGINAL Lifestyle Seduction Guru

Finding Your A-Game:
http://www.cybersheet.com/library.html
Includes 29 Reasons Not To Be A Nice Guy (FREE!)
The book Neil Strauss and VH-1 STOLE The Pivot From

Click HERE: for the ORIGINAL pivot chapter:
http://www.cybersheet.com/pivot.pdf

Here's my Myspace Page: And Pickup Blog (FREE advice)
http://www.myspace.com/snodgrasspublishing

Don't rely on overexposed, mass-marketed commercial seduction methods which
no longer work. Learn the methods the gurus USE with the money they make
from what they teach.

Thinking of taking a seduction "workshiop?" Read THIS:
http://www.dirtyscottsdale.com/?p=1187

Beware! VH-1's "The Pickup Artst" was FRAUDULENT. Six of the eight
contestants were actors, and they used PAID TARGETS in the club. The paid
targets got mad when VH-1 said "there are no actors in this club" and ruined
their prromised acting credit. What else has Mystery lied about?

Date: 25 Jun 2008 12:22:00
From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?J=FCrgen_R.?=
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

<[email protected] > schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:[email protected]...
> OUR GERMAN BLOWHARD
>
> Apparently all this blowhard can do is belittle the efforts of those
> who are truly trying to promote the game he professes to love.

OK, OK I admit it Lubbock, TX is the Athens of the Western World.

Consider the following unique exciting recent events:

In August 1951, a v-shaped formation of lights was seen over the city. The
"Lubbock Lights" series of sightings received national publicity and is
regarded as one of the first great UFO cases. The sightings were considered
credible because they were witnessed by several respected science professors
at Texas Technological College and were photographed by a Texas Tech
student. The photographs were reprinted nationwide in newspapers and in LIFE
magazine. Project Blue Book, the US Air Force's official study of the UFO
mystery, did an extensive investigation of the Lubbock Lights. They
concluded that the photographs were not a hoax and showed genuine objects.

Lubbock Christian University, affiliated with the Churches of Christ, was
founded in 1957.

On May 11, 1970, the Lubbock Tornado struck the city. Twenty-six persons
perished....

Nothing happened since.

More at Wiki.

> J�rgen R. wrote:
>
> And what are all those critics like Juergen doing to promote chess --
>
> Nothing. Nor do I intend to promote chess or anything else.
> Not everyone shares the attitude that everything that pleases you must
> be
> advertised, promoted and sold.
>
>> other than shooting off their mouths?
>
>> I was also informed that funds are available to pay the USCF
>> membership fee for players who can't afford it.
>
> If I can't afford the membership fee I surely can't afford to travel
> to Lubbock, TX.
>

Date: 24 Jun 2008 19:39:55
From: The Historian
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

On Jun 24, 12:15 pm, "Chess One" <[email protected] > wrote:

> .... us journalists.

"Damianovic is your colleague!"

Date: 24 Jun 2008 16:13:54
From: help bot
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

On Jun 24, 1:38 pm, "Chess One" <[email protected] > wrote:

> > You mean somebody might not be thrilled at the idea of spending 4 yrs
> > at a second-rate school in - God help us - Lubbock, TX?

Second-rate because it's in Texas? Anyway,
everything is bigger there, so who cares about
the rates... .

> Yeah - it takes a bit of research about what they are up to in TX, and
> suspicions are justified. Chessville's senior editor went there to
> investigate, and was photographed with a couple of chess fans, one was the
> had of the school which has the largest campus in the USA [if you exclude
> ones with airfileds on them]

Arbitrarily? Why not then also exclude
schools with buildings, or those with trees
or parking lots?

> and the chess fan was key in the discovery of
> water on Mars.

FYI: There is no water on Mars; it's too cold
there, as I discovered when flying my sub a
tad off-course in a mock attack on the moon.
And you can't breathe the air, either (it's akin
to smoking fifty packs of Camels an hour-- a
world record to be sure, but one's very last).

> > Of course, it is better than flunking out of a first-rate school, as Sloan
> > did.

Guess: U.C. Berkley? Maybe it's a personal
bias against the state of Texas... .

> I don't think undergraduate education is worth fighting over in this country
> Jurgen.

Jurgen? FYI: this country is the U.S.A.
You must be thinking of some banana
republic in eastern Europe.

> My daughter attended 2 good east coast schools

(There's that pro-coastal bias again.)

> but switched for her
> last 2 years to a Californian one, since she could get all the courses she
> wanted to there. Must have paid off, since at 26 she has just qualified for
> a fully funded and then some PhD where they only take 20 a year, saving her
> or me about a $100k.

Mere chump change. Look at how much
Yale grads make-- even the dumbest ones;
George Bush can write a book and get paid
a million bucks up front-- no matter how bad
it is! That's even more than Ray Keene gets!

> Its not just availability of good courses, its much to do with student
> attitudes, and although she thought Californians pretty dumb after the East
> Coast prep schools and Univs, she managed to work directly with professors
> since she clearly wanted to take advantage of what opportunities there were,
> and they didn't. So she got the attention, the courses and the
> recommendations necessary in US to make more things happen.

Make things happen? Well, just have her
get a law degree and then go into politics.

> Times have changed in this respect. Someone also wanted to sponsor me for a
> PhD in physics because of my UK high-school knowledge [!] plus a little
> application of my own to electro-optics.

Can you build me an implantable, bionic
eye, like Steve Austin had in The Six
Million Dollar Man? Oh, never mind... I
don't have six million dollars-- YET.

> But I already have a good degree, I said!

Easy to say. A good while back I knew
some folks who wanted to get degrees in
English Lit., but I read that there was a
massive over-supply of such people,
unable to get (paying) jobs. Meanwhile,
we have a terrible shortage of truck drivers
and nurses and such.

> Maybe it is still different in Europe - though I don't think so. Taimanov
> was actually interesting on this; he said that for many bright students in
> Russia their 'only way out' was to either excel academically or sometimes at
> chess. He meant 'out' of regional Russian cities.
>
> The danger, he said, was that for many, their bit of excellence was often
> proved too brittle in the world - he meant this of chess players in
> particular, those who had massive promise, but who really could not live
> adult lives in their own culture since their orientation was too narrow.
>
> If this 'failure' happened to the Sloan, then better the Sloan than our
> Western example of 'brittle', the Fischer.

Mr. Sloan is the opposite of Mr. Fischer;
instead of burying himself in chess to the
exclusion of all else, Mr. Sloan has
traveled the world, become a master of the
game of Go, memorized the age of consent
of every country in the world, and once even
defeated the Supreme Court (although he
lost badly to the S.E.C.) single-handedly.

As for /education/-- from what I've seen
hereabouts, it's all hot air; where is the
evidence of greatness? Are folks on rgc
actually /taught/ to be so biased? so daft?
who teaches this, and in what field do they
earn their prestigious degrees? arrogance?
LOL.

I am once again reminded of the blind-
fold taste tests wherein puffy rich folks
were utterly unable to distinguish between
red and white wines; also I am reminded of
a famous story of an emperor and his new
clothes... .

-- help bot

(discoverer of ice on Mars)

Date: 24 Jun 2008 16:04:21
From:
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

On Jun 24, 5:53=A0pm, "J.D. Walker" <[email protected] > wrote:
> Quadibloc wrote:
> > On Jun 24, 12:04 am, J=FCrgen R. <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> <[email protected]> schrieb im
>
> >> You mean somebody might not be thrilled at the idea of spending 4 yrs
> >> at a second-rate school in - God help us - Lubbock, TX?
>
> > Wasn't that the town that was buzzed by migratory birds from outer
> > space?
>
> > John Savard
>
> My agents have informed me that "It's illegal to sleep in a garbage can
> in Lubbock, Texas."
>
> Those dorm rooms may save someone from spending an unpleasant night in
> the slammer. =A0:)
> --
>
> "Do that which is right..."
>
> Rev. J.D. Walker

Let us not be too hard on Lubbock. A town that gave us Buddy Holly
can't be all bad.

Date: 25 Jun 2008 09:43:26
From: Chess One
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

<[email protected] > wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
On Jun 24, 5:53 pm, "J.D. Walker" <[email protected] > wrote:

Let us not be too hard on Lubbock.

**That'll be the day!

A town that gave us Buddy Holly
can't be all bad.

Date: 24 Jun 2008 15:37:19
From:
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

Chess One wrote:
> <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:fe067cb5-4f6f-4efe-b384-7c2d5ad06e8c@i76g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
> >
> >
> > Chess One wrote:
> >> >
> >> I think Sam Sloan hasn't quite caught up with things. Perhaps in a couple
> >> of
> >> days he'll get it. But maybe I am not rich like him? since $800,000 in
> >> tuition is 'not nuthin'.
> >> Phil Innes
> >
> >
> > In the first place, the $800K in scholarships is over ten years.
>
> Sure. But no less for that?
>
> > More
> > to the point, it is of no use to the winner unless she wants to attend
> > Texas Tech.
>
> Sure.
>
> > That doesn't mean it's worthless, but neither is it the
> > bonanza that Fool, er, I mean Phil,
>
> Whoops! Characterizations have entered in, quaotations have stopped. Indeed
> I never called it a 'Bonanza', but its easier to mock me /as if/ I had,
> rather than what I said, no? Besides, you can get off on being pissy about a
> million bucks, which is the main point for us journalists.
>
> > seems to think.
>
> Oh! only 'seems'? That's weak. Especially since its John Hillery's term, and
> I didn't use it - he is now in danger of seeming to mock himself or his own
> invention of what others 'seem'.
>
> > It's a good deal
> > for the girls. Whether it would also be a good deal for the Denker
> > players is an interesting question, requiring a reasoned analysis of
> > tradeoffs. Somehow I don't expect to see that here.
>
> True - here you get very reluctant praise, lots of pissing contests midst
> that, and instead of even bothering to have a conversation, various wags and
> scoundrels anticipate what others 'seem' as if actual discussion would be
> too wear-making for their poor little minds.
>
> Phil Innes

The qualifier "seems" was inserted for two reasons: a) To avoid
actually _saying_ that you're a blithering idiot/PR flack (choose
one), and b) Your limited command of written English often makes it
hard to determine what you actually mean. (I've never heard you speak,
but second-hand accounts suggest that you are no more coherent in that
medium.) I must thank you, however, for confirming my opinion that no
rational discussion of the subject can be expected while twits like
you infest the place. Why don't you go back to Chessville and let the
grownups discuss these things?

Date: 25 Jun 2008 09:40:30
From: Chess One
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

<[email protected] > wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

> The qualifier "seems" was inserted for two reasons: a) To avoid
> actually _saying_ that you're a blithering idiot/PR flack (choose
> one), and b) Your limited command of written English often makes it
> hard to determine what you actually mean. (I've never heard you speak,
> but second-hand accounts suggest that you are no more coherent in that
> medium.)

Dear John,

While you commend others to their faults, it is yet to be seen if you can
write a single intelligible sentence in any on-topical matter. You seem
content to wish to repress that in others, and suggest things which are
simlpy defamations.

What gossip you permit and admit by second-hand accounts is, I suggest,
something entirely to do with you. When I mentioned CJA's influence over
USCF, you wondered what it was - despite Hanken's previous role, and another
CJA officer currently on the USCF board. Yet you ask, what influence?!!

> I must thank you, however, for confirming my opinion that no
> rational discussion of the subject can be expected while twits like
> you infest the place. Why don't you go back to Chessville and let the
> grownups discuss these things?

How embarrassing for you! Yet another commentary on what you propose
yourself to be, a grown-up capable of addressing a topic. Whereas if you
could discuss something, let us say that you have never demonstrated it -
and chose instead to voluntarily represent second-hand gossip in place of
attempting substantive writing with others in public.

I know that this is merely normative behavior at CJA, and what you
demonstrate here is that 'standard' of journalism. No wonder therefore that
you don't recognise anything else.

What you say is demonstrably refuted by how you behave!

Now - the relevance of this 'influence' of CJA on American chess, and USCF
in particular, cannot be measured by other means that I suggest above - a
culture exists in which what is proclaimed is not from any basis of
demonstrated standards.

In the case of the Denker, we see refusal of substantial benefits to young
men in chess, but with no comparison made with alternatives. The only
arguments I have read here is on how this will effect USCF, rather than
benefit young players. Those are the plain issues, worth public discussion -
and if Denker committee is completely synonymous with USCF, then beyond
praise or blame, let us all understand that.

If CJA folks want to talk in place of Denker/USCF, are their opinions too,
synonymous with those agencies? As represented here, they are. Which was my
initial point!

Phil Innes

Date: 24 Jun 2008 04:47:45
From: [email protected]
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

ALL THOSE CRITICS

And what are all those critics like Juergen doing to promote chess --
other than shooting off their mouths?

I was also informed that funds are available to pay the USCF
membership fee for players who can't afford it.

J=FCrgen R. wrote:
> <[email protected]> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
> news:fe067cb5-4f6f-4efe-b384-7c2d5ad06e8c@i76g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
> >
> >
> > Chess One wrote:
> >> >
> >> I think Sam Sloan hasn't quite caught up with things. Perhaps in a cou=
ple
> >> of
> >> days he'll get it. But maybe I am not rich like him? since $800,000 in
> >> tuition is 'not nuthin'.
> >> Phil Innes
> >
> >
> > In the first place, the $800K in scholarships is over ten years. More
> > to the point, it is of no use to the winner unless she wants to attend
> > Texas Tech. That doesn't mean it's worthless, but neither is it the
> > bonanza that Fool, er, I mean Phil, seems to think. It's a good deal
> > for the girls. Whether it would also be a good deal for the Denker
> > players is an interesting question, requiring a reasoned analysis of
> > tradeoffs. Somehow I don't expect to see that here.
>
> You mean somebody might not be thrilled at the idea of spending 4 yrs
> at a second-rate school in - God help us - Lubbock, TX?
>
> Of course, it is better than flunking out of a first-rate school, as Sloa=
n
> did.

Date: 25 Jun 2008 07:29:11
From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?J=FCrgen_R.?=
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

[...]
>
> And what are all those critics like Juergen doing to promote chess --

Nothing. Nor do I intend to promote chess or anything else.
Not everyone shares the attitude that everything that pleases you must be
advertised, promoted and sold.

> other than shooting off their mouths?
>
> I was also informed that funds are available to pay the USCF
> membership fee for players who can't afford it.
>

If I can't afford the membership fee I surely can't afford to travel
to Lubbock, TX.

>
>
[...]
>> You mean somebody might not be thrilled at the idea of spending 4 yrs
>> at a second-rate school in - God help us - Lubbock, TX?
>>
>> Of course, it is better than flunking out of a first-rate school, as
>> Sloan
>> did.

Date: 24 Jun 2008 04:24:03
From: Quadibloc
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

On Jun 24, 12:04 am, J=FCrgen R. <[email protected] > wrote:
> <[email protected]> schrieb im

> You mean somebody might not be thrilled at the idea of spending 4 yrs
> at a second-rate school in - God help us - Lubbock, TX?

Wasn't that the town that was buzzed by migratory birds from outer
space?

John Savard

Date: 24 Jun 2008 14:53:07
From: J.D. Walker
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

Quadibloc wrote:
> On Jun 24, 12:04 am, J�rgen R. <[email protected]> wrote:
>> <[email protected]> schrieb im
>
>> You mean somebody might not be thrilled at the idea of spending 4 yrs
>> at a second-rate school in - God help us - Lubbock, TX?
>
> Wasn't that the town that was buzzed by migratory birds from outer
> space?
>
> John Savard

My agents have informed me that "It's illegal to sleep in a garbage can
in Lubbock, Texas."

Those dorm rooms may save someone from spending an unpleasant night in
the slammer. :)
--

"Do that which is right..."

Rev. J.D. Walker

Date: 23 Jun 2008 17:22:08
From: Quadibloc
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

On Jun 23, 5:46 pm, [email protected] wrote:

> In the first place, the $800K in scholarships is over ten years. More
> to the point, it is of no use to the winner unless she wants to attend
> Texas Tech. That doesn't mean it's worthless, but neither is it the
> bonanza

Then that explains it. If people want the USCF to do their advertising
for them, they'll have to pay the going rate.

John Savard

Date: 24 Jun 2008 13:18:00
From: Chess One
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

"Quadibloc" <[email protected] > wrote in message
news:7f2820cf-a84f-4c06-be9d-802da60ae4c3@x35g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
> On Jun 23, 5:46 pm, [email protected] wrote:
>
>> In the first place, the $800K in scholarships is over ten years. More
>> to the point, it is of no use to the winner unless she wants to attend
>> Texas Tech. That doesn't mean it's worthless, but neither is it the
>> bonanza
>
> Then that explains it. If people want the USCF to do their advertising
> for them, they'll have to pay the going rate.

The going rate for advertising what benefits especially young chess players
at Chessville is $0. We don't charge for that, we exist to promote that.

USCF do too - but they only say so - they would charge you if you wanted to
say you wanted to donate money to kids in chess. Do I have it right?

Phil Innes

> John Savard

Date: 23 Jun 2008 17:03:22
From: samsloan
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

Once again Susan Polgar has completely falsified the situation. The
Denker Tournament of High School Champions was founded and funded by
Grandmaster Arnold Denker. Grandmaster Denker died in January 2005 but
since then his son has carried on the tradition established by his
father and has continued to provide the finds to hold the event. I
have spoken to the son myself about this and he wants to continue to
hold the tournament in the same format that his father established,
which means that he wants to continue to hold the event at the same
time and place as the US Open Chess Championship is held.

Neither Bill Goichberg nor the USCF has any legal authority to move
the Denker tournament to Lubbock Texas without the permission of the
Denker Family.

Susan Polgar knows this, yet she continues to use this issue to attack
Bill Goichberg. This is just one of numerous instances where Susan
Polgar uses entirely false claims to attack various chess
personalities including myself.

Sam Sloan

Date: 23 Jun 2008 16:46:27
From:
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

Chess One wrote:
> >
> I think Sam Sloan hasn't quite caught up with things. Perhaps in a couple of
> days he'll get it. But maybe I am not rich like him? since $800,000 in
> tuition is 'not nuthin'.
> Phil Innes

In the first place, the $800K in scholarships is over ten years. More
to the point, it is of no use to the winner unless she wants to attend
Texas Tech. That doesn't mean it's worthless, but neither is it the
bonanza that Fool, er, I mean Phil, seems to think. It's a good deal
for the girls. Whether it would also be a good deal for the Denker
players is an interesting question, requiring a reasoned analysis of
tradeoffs. Somehow I don't expect to see that here.

Date: 24 Jun 2008 13:15:01
From: Chess One
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

<[email protected] > wrote in message
news:fe067cb5-4f6f-4efe-b384-7c2d5ad06e8c@i76g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
>
>
> Chess One wrote:
>> >
>> I think Sam Sloan hasn't quite caught up with things. Perhaps in a couple
>> of
>> days he'll get it. But maybe I am not rich like him? since $800,000 in
>> tuition is 'not nuthin'.
>> Phil Innes
>
>
> In the first place, the $800K in scholarships is over ten years.

Sure. But no less for that?

> More
> to the point, it is of no use to the winner unless she wants to attend
> Texas Tech.

Sure.

> That doesn't mean it's worthless, but neither is it the
> bonanza that Fool, er, I mean Phil,

Whoops! Characterizations have entered in, quaotations have stopped. Indeed
I never called it a 'Bonanza', but its easier to mock me /as if/ I had,
rather than what I said, no? Besides, you can get off on being pissy about a
million bucks, which is the main point for us journalists.

> seems to think.

Oh! only 'seems'? That's weak. Especially since its John Hillery's term, and
I didn't use it - he is now in danger of seeming to mock himself or his own
invention of what others 'seem'.

> It's a good deal
> for the girls. Whether it would also be a good deal for the Denker
> players is an interesting question, requiring a reasoned analysis of
> tradeoffs. Somehow I don't expect to see that here.

True - here you get very reluctant praise, lots of pissing contests midst
that, and instead of even bothering to have a conversation, various wags and
scoundrels anticipate what others 'seem' as if actual discussion would be
too wear-making for their poor little minds.

Phil Innes

Date: 24 Jun 2008 08:04:44
From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?J=FCrgen_R.?=
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

<[email protected] > schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:fe067cb5-4f6f-4efe-b384-7c2d5ad06e8c@i76g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
>
>
> Chess One wrote:
>> >
>> I think Sam Sloan hasn't quite caught up with things. Perhaps in a couple
>> of
>> days he'll get it. But maybe I am not rich like him? since $800,000 in
>> tuition is 'not nuthin'.
>> Phil Innes
>
>
> In the first place, the $800K in scholarships is over ten years. More
> to the point, it is of no use to the winner unless she wants to attend
> Texas Tech. That doesn't mean it's worthless, but neither is it the
> bonanza that Fool, er, I mean Phil, seems to think. It's a good deal
> for the girls. Whether it would also be a good deal for the Denker
> players is an interesting question, requiring a reasoned analysis of
> tradeoffs. Somehow I don't expect to see that here.

You mean somebody might not be thrilled at the idea of spending 4 yrs
at a second-rate school in - God help us - Lubbock, TX?

Of course, it is better than flunking out of a first-rate school, as Sloan
did.

Date: 24 Jun 2008 13:38:50
From: Chess One
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

"J�rgen R." <[email protected] > wrote in message news:[email protected]...
>
>
> <[email protected]> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
> news:fe067cb5-4f6f-4efe-b384-7c2d5ad06e8c@i76g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
>>
>>
>> Chess One wrote:
>>> >
>>> I think Sam Sloan hasn't quite caught up with things. Perhaps in a
>>> couple of
>>> days he'll get it. But maybe I am not rich like him? since $800,000 in
>>> tuition is 'not nuthin'.
>>> Phil Innes
>>
>>
>> In the first place, the $800K in scholarships is over ten years. More
>> to the point, it is of no use to the winner unless she wants to attend
>> Texas Tech. That doesn't mean it's worthless, but neither is it the
>> bonanza that Fool, er, I mean Phil, seems to think. It's a good deal
>> for the girls. Whether it would also be a good deal for the Denker
>> players is an interesting question, requiring a reasoned analysis of
>> tradeoffs. Somehow I don't expect to see that here.
>
> You mean somebody might not be thrilled at the idea of spending 4 yrs
> at a second-rate school in - God help us - Lubbock, TX?

Yeah - it takes a bit of research about what they are up to in TX, and
suspicions are justified. Chessville's senior editor went there to
investigate, and was photographed with a couple of chess fans, one was the
had of the school which has the largest campus in the USA [if you exclude
ones with airfileds on them] and the chess fan was key in the discovery of
water on Mars.

> Of course, it is better than flunking out of a first-rate school, as Sloan
> did.

I don't think undergraduate education is worth fighting over in this country
Jurgen. My daughter attended 2 good east coast schools, but switched for her
last 2 years to a Californian one, since she could get all the courses she
wanted to there. Must have paid off, since at 26 she has just qualified for
a fully funded and then some PhD where they only take 20 a year, saving her
or me about a $100k.

Its not just availability of good courses, its much to do with student
attitudes, and although she thought Californians pretty dumb after the East
Coast prep schools and Univs, she managed to work directly with professors
since she clearly wanted to take advantage of what opportunities there were,
and they didn't. So she got the attention, the courses and the
recommendations necessary in US to make more things happen.

Times have changed in this respect. Someone also wanted to sponsor me for a
PhD in physics because of my UK high-school knowledge [!] plus a little
application of my own to electro-optics. But I already have a good degree, I
said!

Maybe it is still different in Europe - though I don't think so. Taimanov
was actually interesting on this; he said that for many bright students in
Russia their 'only way out' was to either excel academically or sometimes at
chess. He meant 'out' of regional Russian cities.

The danger, he said, was that for many, their bit of excellence was often
proved too brittle in the world - he meant this of chess players in
particular, those who had massive promise, but who really could not live
adult lives in their own culture since their orientation was too narrow.

If this 'failure' happened to the Sloan, then better the Sloan than our
Western example of 'brittle', the Fischer.

Phil Innes

Date: 25 Jun 2008 07:51:52
From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?J=FCrgen_R.?=
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

[...]
>
> Times have changed in this respect. Someone also wanted to sponsor me for
> a PhD in physics because of my UK high-school knowledge [!] plus a little
> application of my own to electro-optics. But I already have a good degree,
> I said!

Electro-Optics, eh?

What a bunch of poppycock.

Once in a bragging mood you evidently don't know where to stop.

>
> Maybe it is still different in Europe - though I don't think so. Taimanov
> was actually interesting on this; he said that for many bright students in
> Russia their 'only way out' was to either excel academically or sometimes
> at chess. He meant 'out' of regional Russian cities.
>
> The danger, he said, was that for many, their bit of excellence was often
> proved too brittle in the world - he meant this of chess players in
> particular, those who had massive promise, but who really could not live
> adult lives in their own culture since their orientation was too narrow.
>
> If this 'failure' happened to the Sloan,

So it is 'excellence' that caused Sloan to fail at everything he ever
tried, including driving a taxi in NYC?

> then better the Sloan than our Western example of 'brittle', the Fischer.
>
> Phil Innes
>
>
>

Date: 23 Jun 2008 10:08:22
From: samsloan
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

It seems that Phil Innes is not aware of the history of these events.

The Denker Tournament of High School Champions was established by
Arnold Denker, who funded the event. The tournament is held at the
same time and place as the US Open, expect that games in the Denker
take place in the morning and games of the US Open take place in the
evening.

The vast majority of players in the Denker also play in the US Open.

About five years ago the USCF Delegates voted to establish a parallel
tournament for girls, also to be held in connection with the US Open.

When Susan Polgar heard about this, she asked that it be named the
Polgar. I think the Polgar has only been held about four times.

Many state chess associations provide money to help their state high
school champion attend the Denker. This is what has made the Denker a
successful tournament.

When I was on the board at the board meeting in Stillwater, Oklahoma,
May 17-18, 2007 the board learned that Polgar wanted to take over both
the Polgar and the Denker tournaments and move them both to Lubbock,
Texas.

The board rejected the Polgar plan to move the Denker to Lubbock
especially since the Denker Family which continues to fund the event
did not want to make any changes.

This year will be the first year that the Polgar will be held in
Lubbock Texas. Most likely they are having trouble getting players to
play. For example, only four players completed in the US Junior
Championship this year and that event has far more prestige than does
the Polgar tournament.

Sam Sloan

Date: 23 Jun 2008 13:08:08
From: Ray Gordon, creator of the \pivot\
Subject: Re: Title 9??

Imagine if someone had sponsored a BOYS' tournament and not a GIRLS'
tournament the same way. Or is this how Texas Tech is balancing the overall
sporting budget to compensate for the men's sports like football etc?

It should be noted that the cost to Texas Tech for this sponsorship is not
the retail value to the recipients, even if it is substantial.

The value of chess as an education al tool is dubious. For every mind is
sharpens, it seems to waste others with unhealthy addictions to the game,
often fueled by the quasi-academic legitimacy the "sport" gets.

Date: 23 Jun 2008 09:53:36
From: The Historian
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

On Jun 23, 10:50 am, "[email protected]" <[email protected] > wrote:
> ANONYMOUS DONOR
>
> I was informed that the donor wishes to remain anonymous.

How fitting for a project that's connected to Mr. Truong.

Date: 23 Jun 2008 08:59:39
From: samsloan
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

On Jun 23, 9:58 am, "Chess One" <[email protected] > wrote:
> A cool million for girls, nothing for Denker boys?
>
> announced this morning:
>
> see:http://susanpolgar.blogspot.com/2008/06/huge-sponsorship-deal-by-texa...
>
> I suspect people will readily state their own opinions on this news without
> much prompting - but the immediate issue for me is if Bill Goichberg has a
> better deal up his sleeve? If not, then is USCF's need to keep control of
> the Denker more important than putting a million into what USCF was
> established to do in the first place - to promote the game?
>
> Phil Innes

What a joke! The "million dollars" involves NO MONEY. It only means
out-of-state tuition scholarships to Texas Tech University not usable
anywhere, plus two-in-a-room accommodation in the university
dormitories for the players only, the parents have to pay, plus meals
in the university cafeteria.

In short, this "million dollar offer" costs Texas Tech University
nothing and provides no money to the players. The players will still
have to pay their own transportation out to the Bad Lands of West
Texas where nothing else will be happening.

Also, the USCF did not "reject" the "offer" for the Denker. The Denker
Family wanted to keep the tournament the same way that Arnold Denker
had set it up. If the Denker Family had wanted to move the tournament
away from the US Open and place it permanently in Lubbock Texas, the
USCF would have had nothing to say about it.

Susan Polgar is welcome to establish her own tournament for boys in
Lubbock Texas. The USCF will have no objection. Meanwhile, I feel that
the USCF should reconsider my motion which I made while on the board
that the USCF establishes a tournament for girl high school champions
to be held at the same time and place as the US Open Chess
Championship. That what the tournament was before the USCF agreed to
Susan's request that the event be re-named "The Polgar".

Sam Sloan

Date: 23 Jun 2008 12:17:21
From: Chess One
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

"samsloan" <[email protected] > wrote in message
news:827a573f-d3cf-4168-938b-d32bcd02c99e@z72g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
> On Jun 23, 9:58 am, "Chess One" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> A cool million for girls, nothing for Denker boys?
>>
>> announced this morning:
>>
>> see:http://susanpolgar.blogspot.com/2008/06/huge-sponsorship-deal-by-texa...
>>
>> I suspect people will readily state their own opinions on this news
>> without
>> much prompting - but the immediate issue for me is if Bill Goichberg has
>> a
>> better deal up his sleeve? If not, then is USCF's need to keep control of
>> the Denker more important than putting a million into what USCF was
>> established to do in the first place - to promote the game?
>>
>> Phil Innes
>
> What a joke! The "million dollars" involves NO MONEY. It only means
> out-of-state tuition scholarships to Texas Tech University not usable
> anywhere, plus two-in-a-room accommodation in the university
> dormitories for the players only, the parents have to pay, plus meals
> in the university cafeteria.

I think Sam Sloan hasn't quite caught up with things. Perhaps in a couple of
days he'll get it. But maybe I am not rich like him? since $800,000 in
tuition is 'not nuthin'.

> In short, this "million dollar offer" costs Texas Tech University
> nothing and provides no money to the players.

I suppose I must pass trying to understand sentences like that. Where I come
from, and being a father of 5, tuitions do actually cost someone something.
In terms of 'money to the players' it surely offsets other expenses, so
students [or their parents] don't have to part with money - therefore
//thunderbolt// the get to have their own money, not pay it!

> The players will still
> have to pay their own transportation out to the Bad Lands of West
> Texas where nothing else will be happening.
>
> Also, the USCF did not "reject" the "offer" for the Denker. The Denker
> Family wanted to keep the tournament the same way that Arnold Denker
> had set it up. If the Denker Family had wanted to move the tournament
> away from the US Open and place it permanently in Lubbock Texas, the
> USCF would have had nothing to say about it.

About what? Where the Denker is held? What does it want to say about it? It
favors some motel in Jersey City?

> Susan Polgar is welcome to establish her own tournament for boys in
> Lubbock Texas. The USCF will have no objection.

Since there is a very serious prospect of USCF's staff being decimated this
winter and its consequential inability to choose Jersey motels - and since
the idea is finding competitive advantages for the Denker - not the typical
USCF destructive attitude of control or death - then I msut suppose Sam
Sloan would actually prefer competition, which would actually water down the
effect of either, rather than provide the best for the participants?

> Meanwhile, I feel that
> the USCF should reconsider my motion which I made while on the board
> that the USCF establishes a tournament for girl high school champions
> to be held at the same time and place as the US Open Chess
> Championship. That what the tournament was before the USCF agreed to
> Susan's request that the event be re-named "The Polgar".

How are they going to pay for that, genius? They are in a chronic financial
state, and probably shouldn't engage in additional monkey business.

Phil Innes

---
> Sam Sloan

Date: 23 Jun 2008 08:50:59
From: [email protected]
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

ANONYMOUS DONOR

I was informed that the donor wishes to remain anonymous.

Chess One wrote:
> "SBD" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:71c31f34-8c35-423b-9070-ea99385a75f4@f36g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
> > On Jun 23, 9:58 am, "Chess One" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >> I suspect people will readily state their own opinions on this news
> >> without
> >> much prompting - but the immediate issue for me is if Bill Goichberg has
> >> a
> >> better deal up his sleeve? If not, then is USCF's need to keep control of
> >> the Denker more important than putting a million into what USCF was
> >> established to do in the first place - to promote the game?
> >
> >
> > Perhaps a scholarship to TTU was seen as not worth it,
>
> Not seen by whom?
>
> The blog says something about 75% parental approval. But I can understand
> 'not seen by USCF', since they are not the beneficiary of monies awarded the
> Denker, the players are - and obviously that is not what USCF is about!
>
> > or perhaps
> > promoting one university over another, which would not be the job of
> > the fed.
>
> Not the job of the Fed to fund programs it manages, but to turn down money?
> I don't understand.
>
> > Lots of potential reasons, lots of parrot squakings and other
> > droppings to follow soon though, I'm sure. If there is a good reason,
> > you'll find a way to make it look like a bad one.
>
> Our Stephen doesn't suggest any specific other reasons, does not discuss the
> benefit to chess parents, at least as we understand it from that 75%
> approval, but the comparison of who is succeeding and who is not is reason
> enough form him to talk of 'droppings'
>
> To remove this topic from the usual rancor, does anyone actually know
> specifics of what USCF can provide for the Denker, other than the vacuous
> 'lots' above?
>
> Phil Innes

Date: 23 Jun 2008 14:13:04
From: Ray Gordon, creator of the \pivot\
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

> ANONYMOUS DONOR
>
> I was informed that the donor wishes to remain anonymous.

You mean it's not Erik Moscow?

--
--
Ray Gordon, The ORIGINAL Lifestyle Seduction Guru

Finding Your A-Game:
http://www.cybersheet.com/library.html
Includes 29 Reasons Not To Be A Nice Guy (FREE!)
The book Neil Strauss and VH-1 STOLE The Pivot From

Click HERE: for the ORIGINAL pivot chapter:
http://www.cybersheet.com/pivot.pdf

Here's my Myspace Page: And Pickup Blog (FREE advice)
http://www.myspace.com/snodgrasspublishing

Don't rely on overexposed, mass-marketed commercial seduction methods which
no longer work. Learn the methods the gurus USE with the money they make
from what they teach.

Thinking of taking a seduction "workshiop?" Read THIS:
http://www.dirtyscottsdale.com/?p=1187

Beware! VH-1's "The Pickup Artst" was FRAUDULENT. Six of the eight
contestants were actors, and they used PAID TARGETS in the club. The paid
targets got mad when VH-1 said "there are no actors in this club" and ruined
their prromised acting credit. What else has Mystery lied about?

Date: 23 Jun 2008 08:27:02
From: SBD
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

On Jun 23, 9:58 am, "Chess One" <[email protected] > wrote:

> I suspect people will readily state their own opinions on this news without
> much prompting - but the immediate issue for me is if Bill Goichberg has a
> better deal up his sleeve? If not, then is USCF's need to keep control of
> the Denker more important than putting a million into what USCF was
> established to do in the first place - to promote the game?

Perhaps a scholarship to TTU was seen as not worth it, or perhaps
promoting one university over another, which would not be the job of
the fed. Lots of potential reasons, lots of parrot squakings and other
droppings to follow soon though, I'm sure. If there is a good reason,
you'll find a way to make it look like a bad one.

Date: 23 Jun 2008 11:42:04
From: Chess One
Subject: Re: USCF turn down a million$

"SBD" <[email protected] > wrote in message
news:71c31f34-8c35-423b-9070-ea99385a75f4@f36g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
> On Jun 23, 9:58 am, "Chess One" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> I suspect people will readily state their own opinions on this news
>> without
>> much prompting - but the immediate issue for me is if Bill Goichberg has
>> a
>> better deal up his sleeve? If not, then is USCF's need to keep control of
>> the Denker more important than putting a million into what USCF was
>> established to do in the first place - to promote the game?
>
>
> Perhaps a scholarship to TTU was seen as not worth it,

Not seen by whom?

The blog says something about 75% parental approval. But I can understand
'not seen by USCF', since they are not the beneficiary of monies awarded the
Denker, the players are - and obviously that is not what USCF is about!

> or perhaps
> promoting one university over another, which would not be the job of
> the fed.

Not the job of the Fed to fund programs it manages, but to turn down money?
I don't understand.

> Lots of potential reasons, lots of parrot squakings and other
> droppings to follow soon though, I'm sure. If there is a good reason,
> you'll find a way to make it look like a bad one.

Our Stephen doesn't suggest any specific other reasons, does not discuss the
benefit to chess parents, at least as we understand it from that 75%
approval, but the comparison of who is succeeding and who is not is reason
enough form him to talk of 'droppings'

To remove this topic from the usual rancor, does anyone actually know
specifics of what USCF can provide for the Denker, other than the vacuous
'lots' above?

Phil Innes