Reading .ctb, .cto, .ctg files

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Date:
From: Martin Brown
Subject: Reading .ctb, .cto, .ctg files

Date: 26 Dec 2006 03:33:40
From: Mark Houlsby
Subject: Re: Reading .ctb, .cto, .ctg files

David Richerby wrote:

> k Houlsby <[email protected]> wrote:
> > David Richerby wrote:
> >> <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>> Angelo missed the point of your question. You want to convert
> >>> directly from finished book to the component games of a book. That
> >>> is not possible. It's simply a no-can-do, not even by Chessbase,
> >>> because a book is the end-product of an iterative, non-reversible
> >>> database-building process.
> >>
> >> Nonsense!
> >
> > No it isn't - see below.
>
> Yes it is. It is perfectly possible to write such a program. Any
> programmer at ChessBase could do it in a couple of hours.
>

Any programmer at ChessBase? So why not a st programmer outside of
ChessBase?

For that matter, why not you? BTW I am aware of reverse engineering...
FYI I was challenging you to put your money where your mouth is, is
all. The OP *talked about parsing*.

It was your having been unnecessarily rude in your first post in this
thread which prompted my response to you.

You think you're st. Prove it.

Or shut up and go away.

k.

Date: 25 Dec 2006 14:32:32
From: Mark Houlsby
Subject: Re: Reading .ctb, .cto, .ctg files

[email protected] wrote:

> k Houlsby wrote:
> > David Richerby wrote:
> >
> > > <[email protected]> wrote:
> > > > Angelo missed the point of your question. You want to convert
> > > > directly from finished book to the component games of a book. That
> > > > is not possible. It's simply a no-can-do, not even by Chessbase,
> > > > because a book is the end-product of an iterative, non-reversible
> > > > database-building process.
> > >
> > > Nonsense!
> >
> > No it isn't - see below.
> >
> > > It may well be that Chessbase don't have (even internally)
> > > any software to convert from opening books to PGN but, knowing the
> > > format of the opening book, it would be simple to output a PGN file
> > > with one game per book line.
> > >
> >
> > This would involve playing through each line in the tree, one at a
> > time. Typically, opening trees run to around 100,000-500,000 games.
> >
> > Do you volunteer to go through all the games, saving each fragment
> > individually as a PGN file (itself not the simplest of tasks in
> > ChessBase, which prefers CB6+ format?
> >
> There is something called a computer program which is very good at
> simple, repetitive tasks. Writing a program to output a chess database
> as a series of pgn files is not particularly difficult if you know the
> database format.
>

Right. I think I knew that. The point is that the *.ctg, *.ctb and
*.cto formats have, as yet,
proved impossible to parse.

This prompted the OP's having made the request in, how shall one put
this... the top post.

My belligerent response to Richerby was to point out that, once again,
he is putting in his oar without clearly understanding the implications
either of what the OP was asking or, more especially, of what he was
writing.

In short, he's a troll. A pathetic troll, but a troll nonetheless.

Should you be able to parse the above files, I shall be in the queue
right behind the OP.

It may be that you have already done so.

If so... how may one contact you, please?

Thanks for your post.

k

<snip >

Date: 25 Dec 2006 13:59:29
From:
Subject: Re: Reading .ctb, .cto, .ctg files

k Houlsby wrote:
> David Richerby wrote:
>
> > <[email protected]> wrote:
> > > Angelo missed the point of your question. You want to convert
> > > directly from finished book to the component games of a book. That
> > > is not possible. It's simply a no-can-do, not even by Chessbase,
> > > because a book is the end-product of an iterative, non-reversible
> > > database-building process.
> >
> > Nonsense!
>
> No it isn't - see below.
>
> > It may well be that Chessbase don't have (even internally)
> > any software to convert from opening books to PGN but, knowing the
> > format of the opening book, it would be simple to output a PGN file
> > with one game per book line.
> >
>
> This would involve playing through each line in the tree, one at a
> time. Typically, opening trees run to around 100,000-500,000 games.
>
> Do you volunteer to go through all the games, saving each fragment
> individually as a PGN file (itself not the simplest of tasks in
> ChessBase, which prefers CB6+ format?
>
There is something called a computer program which is very good at
simple, repetitive tasks. Writing a program to output a chess database
as a series of pgn files is not particularly difficult if you know the
database format.

> > Now, the games in the PGN file would only contain as many moves as are
> > in the book, so it wouldn't (in most cases) be possible to recover the
> > full component game. And it wouldn't be possible to recover the names
> > of the players and so on. But tin never asked for any of that.
> >
>
> No, he didn't. Neither did he ask for uninformed and stupid answers.
Very true.
>
> k
>
> >
> > Dave.
> >
> > --
> > David Richerby Permanent Tool (TM): it's like
> > www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~davidr/ a screwdriver but it'll be there
> > for ever!

Date: 25 Dec 2006 09:48:53
From: Mark Houlsby
Subject: Re: Reading .ctb, .cto, .ctg files

David Richerby wrote:

> <[email protected]> wrote:
> > Angelo missed the point of your question. You want to convert
> > directly from finished book to the component games of a book. That
> > is not possible. It's simply a no-can-do, not even by Chessbase,
> > because a book is the end-product of an iterative, non-reversible
> > database-building process.
>
> Nonsense!

No it isn't - see below.

> It may well be that Chessbase don't have (even internally)
> any software to convert from opening books to PGN but, knowing the
> format of the opening book, it would be simple to output a PGN file
> with one game per book line.
>

This would involve playing through each line in the tree, one at a
time. Typically, opening trees run to around 100,000-500,000 games.

Do you volunteer to go through all the games, saving each fragment
individually as a PGN file (itself not the simplest of tasks in
ChessBase, which prefers CB6+ format?

> Now, the games in the PGN file would only contain as many moves as are
> in the book, so it wouldn't (in most cases) be possible to recover the
> full component game. And it wouldn't be possible to recover the names
> of the players and so on. But tin never asked for any of that.
>

No, he didn't. Neither did he ask for uninformed and stupid answers.

k

>
> Dave.
>
> --
> David Richerby Permanent Tool (TM): it's like
> www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~davidr/ a screwdriver but it'll be there
> for ever!

Date: 26 Dec 2006 01:59:05
From: David Richerby
Subject: Re: Reading .ctb, .cto, .ctg files

k Houlsby <[email protected] > wrote:
> David Richerby wrote:
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> Angelo missed the point of your question. You want to convert
>>> directly from finished book to the component games of a book. That
>>> is not possible. It's simply a no-can-do, not even by Chessbase,
>>> because a book is the end-product of an iterative, non-reversible
>>> database-building process.
>>
>> Nonsense!
>
> No it isn't - see below.

Yes it is. It is perfectly possible to write such a program. Any
programmer at ChessBase could do it in a couple of hours.

Dave.

--
David Richerby Mentholated Composer (TM): it's
www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~davidr/ like a pupil of Beethoven but it's
invigorating!

Date: 24 Dec 2006 16:46:42
From:
Subject: Re: Reading .ctb, .cto, .ctg files

k Houlsby wrote:
> Ange1o DePa1ma wrote:
>
> > You can convert the files to pgn and read them with any chess playing
> > software.
> >
>
> How?
>
> k

Angelo missed the point of your question. You want to convert directly
from finished book to the component games of a book. That is not
possible. It's simply a no-can-do, not even by Chessbase, because a
book is the end-product of an iterative, non-reversible
database-building process. It's a different kind of database, that's
all.

Converting a .cbh file to .pgn on the other hand is very easy. I trust
you know how to do that so I won't go into the details.

Date: 25 Dec 2006 10:18:44
From: David Richerby
Subject: Re: Reading .ctb, .cto, .ctg files

<[email protected] > wrote:
> Angelo missed the point of your question. You want to convert
> directly from finished book to the component games of a book. That
> is not possible. It's simply a no-can-do, not even by Chessbase,
> because a book is the end-product of an iterative, non-reversible
> database-building process.

Nonsense! It may well be that Chessbase don't have (even internally)
any software to convert from opening books to PGN but, knowing the
format of the opening book, it would be simple to output a PGN file
with one game per book line.

Now, the games in the PGN file would only contain as many moves as are
in the book, so it wouldn't (in most cases) be possible to recover the
full component game. And it wouldn't be possible to recover the names
of the players and so on. But tin never asked for any of that.

Dave.

--
David Richerby Permanent Tool (TM): it's like
www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~davidr/ a screwdriver but it'll be there
for ever!

Date: 24 Dec 2006 05:04:41
From: Mark Houlsby
Subject: Re: Reading .ctb, .cto, .ctg files

Ange1o DePa1ma wrote:

> You can convert the files to pgn and read them with any chess playing
> software.
>

How?

k

> Angelo
>
> "tin Brown" <

Date: 22 Dec 2006 13:00:27
From: Ange1o DePa1ma
Subject: Re: Reading .ctb, .cto, .ctg files

You can convert the files to pgn and read them with any chess playing
software.

Angelo

"tin Brown" <

Date: 21 Dec 2006 14:37:12
From: David Richerby
Subject: Re: Reading .ctb, .cto, .ctg files

tin Brown <