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Main
Date: 30 Nov 2007 03:09:57
From: Sanny
Subject: GetClub Chess further improved.
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GetClub Game was further improved. The old trick that nomorechess
suggested is not working as it lost 5/5 games. It lost to stykumb who
was unable to win earlier. So that improvement has been removed.
Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
Now it will think much deeper. And only the Beginner Level will play a
simple game. Higher Level will play much stronger.
Bye
Sanny
Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
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Date: 09 Dec 2007 21:29:21
From: Sanny
Subject: Re: GetClub Chess further improved.
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On Dec 7, 10:40 pm, Ron <[email protected] > wrote:
> In article
> <45dba4e1-18bf-4f0d-acef-d2c608fa6...@e25g2000prg.googlegroups.com>,
>
> Sanny <[email protected]> wrote:
> > What Level you are Playing? Should I reset your Game?
>
> You should make your program not suck.
>
> -Ron
That happens in 1 out of 200 Games played by you.
Yesterday GetClub win 2/4 Games played by Helpbot with Beginner Level.
Bye
Sanny
Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
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Date: 02 Dec 2007 23:49:31
From: Sanny
Subject: Re: GetClub Chess further improved.
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On Dec 3, 12:24 pm, help bot <[email protected] > wrote:
> On Dec 2, 4:42 am, Sanny <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > > How? I am still fighting for my life in a position
> > > which should have been detected by the program
> > > as an "insufficient mating material draw". I can't
> > > move, I can't resign because it's not my turn, and
> > > I can't lose unless and until another fluke auto-
> > > termination occurs, zapping my rating like before.
>
> > It happens sometime that the program keeps thinking forever in such
> > case Just restart and the Program will make move in time.
>
> > Begiiner will take Less than 30 Seconds always.
> > Easy will take Less than 100 Seconds always.
> > Normal will take Less than 480 Seconds always.
> > Master will take Less than 1900 Seconds always.
>
> > If any level takes more time than Stated above it means the program
> > has crashed and its better to restart the game.
>
> This particular position has been restarted
> countless times. What happens is this: the
> fan kicks on, indicating heavy usage of the
> processor (i.e. "thinking"); then, about two or
> three seconds afterwards, the fan goes off, as
> if the program were about to play a move. But
> it never does; it just sits there. It's the same
> every time, and because of that I think the
> program has somehow found its way to a dead
> end.
>
> Like I said, the program is unbeatable now. :>D
>
> -- help bot- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
What Level you are Playing? Should I reset your Game?
Bye
Sanny
Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
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Date: 07 Dec 2007 17:40:02
From: Ron
Subject: Re: GetClub Chess further improved.
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In article
<45dba4e1-18bf-4f0d-acef-d2c608fa642f@e25g2000prg.googlegroups.com >,
Sanny <[email protected] > wrote:
> What Level you are Playing? Should I reset your Game?
You should make your program not suck.
-Ron
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Date: 02 Dec 2007 23:24:42
From: help bot
Subject: Re: GetClub Chess further improved.
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On Dec 2, 4:42 am, Sanny <[email protected] > wrote:
> > How? I am still fighting for my life in a position
> > which should have been detected by the program
> > as an "insufficient mating material draw". I can't
> > move, I can't resign because it's not my turn, and
> > I can't lose unless and until another fluke auto-
> > termination occurs, zapping my rating like before.
>
> It happens sometime that the program keeps thinking forever in such
> case Just restart and the Program will make move in time.
>
> Begiiner will take Less than 30 Seconds always.
> Easy will take Less than 100 Seconds always.
> Normal will take Less than 480 Seconds always.
> Master will take Less than 1900 Seconds always.
>
> If any level takes more time than Stated above it means the program
> has crashed and its better to restart the game.
This particular position has been restarted
countless times. What happens is this: the
fan kicks on, indicating heavy usage of the
processor (i.e. "thinking"); then, about two or
three seconds afterwards, the fan goes off, as
if the program were about to play a move. But
it never does; it just sits there. It's the same
every time, and because of that I think the
program has somehow found its way to a dead
end.
Like I said, the program is unbeatable now. : >D
-- help bot
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Date: 02 Dec 2007 01:44:37
From: Sanny
Subject: Re: GetClub Chess further improved.
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On Dec 2, 11:22 am, help bot <[email protected] > wrote:
> On Dec 2, 12:38 am, Sanny <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Dec 1, 11:20 am, help bot <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > On Nov 30, 6:09 am, Sanny <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > > PlayChessat:http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
>
> > > > Now it will think much deeper. And only the Beginner Level will play a
> > > > simple game. Higher Level will play much stronger.
>
> > > As far as I can see, whatever level I'm playing now
> > > is unbeatable (and undrawable, and unloseable); I
> > > still have just a King, versus a King and Knight, and
> > > the program still refuses to move, out of sheer
> > > stubbornness. I have the King cut off, and the Knight
> > > is on the run; it's only a matter of time before I get to
> > > one or the other; you can run, but you can't hide.
>
> > You only have a King, Then you have to press the Resign Button as
> > there is no way out.
>
> LOL!
>
> Sanny, the rules ofchessdictate that the instant
> the position got to K vs. K & N, the game was a
> draw by insufficient mating material. I have no beef
> with quirks like King capture in place of checkmate,
> but this is something your programmers need to fix,
> in order to even approximate legalchess.
>
> Once again, the "resigns" button is not an option,
> because it is not my turn to move and thus, that
> button is not even on the screen.
>
> Your program inexplicably goes brain-dead at
> times, and I think it may have something to do
> with potential repetitions of position, nearness to
> checkmate or stalemate-- something along those
> lines.
>
> Besides, I still think I can win... . ;>D
>
> -- help bot- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
It happens sometime that the program keeps thinking forever in such
case Just restart and the Program will make move in time.
Begiiner will take Less than 30 Seconds always.
Easy will take Less than 100 Seconds always.
Normal will take Less than 480 Seconds always.
Master will take Less than 1900 Seconds always.
If any level takes more time than Stated above it means the program
has crashed and its better to restart the game.
Bye
Sanny
Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
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Date: 02 Dec 2007 01:42:41
From: Sanny
Subject: Re: GetClub Chess further improved.
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> How? I am still fighting for my life in a position
> which should have been detected by the program
> as an "insufficient mating material draw". I can't
> move, I can't resign because it's not my turn, and
> I can't lose unless and until another fluke auto-
> termination occurs, zapping my rating like before.
>
It happens sometime that the program keeps thinking forever in such
case Just restart and the Program will make move in time.
Begiiner will take Less than 30 Seconds always.
Easy will take Less than 100 Seconds always.
Normal will take Less than 480 Seconds always.
Master will take Less than 1900 Seconds always.
If any level takes more time than Stated above it means the program
has crashed and its better to restart the game.
Bye
Sanny
Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
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Date: 01 Dec 2007 22:22:45
From: help bot
Subject: Re: GetClub Chess further improved.
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On Dec 2, 12:38 am, Sanny <[email protected] > wrote:
> On Dec 1, 11:20 am, help bot <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > On Nov 30, 6:09 am, Sanny <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > PlayChessat:http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
>
> > > Now it will think much deeper. And only the Beginner Level will play a
> > > simple game. Higher Level will play much stronger.
>
> > As far as I can see, whatever level I'm playing now
> > is unbeatable (and undrawable, and unloseable); I
> > still have just a King, versus a King and Knight, and
> > the program still refuses to move, out of sheer
> > stubbornness. I have the King cut off, and the Knight
> > is on the run; it's only a matter of time before I get to
> > one or the other; you can run, but you can't hide.
>
> You only have a King, Then you have to press the Resign Button as
> there is no way out.
LOL!
Sanny, the rules of chess dictate that the instant
the position got to K vs. K & N, the game was a
draw by insufficient mating material. I have no beef
with quirks like King capture in place of checkmate,
but this is something your programmers need to fix,
in order to even approximate legal chess.
Once again, the "resigns" button is not an option,
because it is not my turn to move and thus, that
button is not even on the screen.
Your program inexplicably goes brain-dead at
times, and I think it may have something to do
with potential repetitions of position, nearness to
checkmate or stalemate-- something along those
lines.
Besides, I still think I can win... . ; >D
-- help bot
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Date: 01 Dec 2007 22:13:15
From: help bot
Subject: Re: GetClub Chess further improved.
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On Dec 2, 12:37 am, Sanny <[email protected] > wrote:
> > That "trick", as Sanny calls it, is standard practice in all
> > decentchessprograms since the middle ages; whenever
> > there is a check or a capture, the search is deepened
> > until a quiet position is reached (or at least until a certain
> > cutoff depth) to enable more accurate calculation of
> > exchanges and mating attacks.
>
> Yes your technique is good but the way my programmers implemented it
> reduced its depth to 2 level deep. So When there is a move with no
> Check/ Capture it played the moves with just 2 level depth. and it
> lost all the matches it played.
>
> Play Chess at:http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
>
> Now it has been removed. And it will be done soon again with better
> technique. as current implementation made it play very bad.
>
> > Implemented *correctly*, this technique I would expect
> > adds hundreds of rating points worth in tactical strength;
> > done wrong, it is impossible to determine the potential
> > damage. You see, unlike stupidity, genius has its
> > limits.
>
> > -- help bot
>
> Play a few games with Easy & Normal Level & see if it needs Check &
> Capture. If yes then it will be again added but this time using a new
> method that will not reduce its depth of search.
How? I am still fighting for my life in a position
which should have been detected by the program
as an "insufficient mating material draw". I can't
move, I can't resign because it's not my turn, and
I can't lose unless and until another fluke auto-
termination occurs, zapping my rating like before.
Somewhere on the 'net there are articles which
explain precisely how the check-and-capture
extensions work, and how to implement them.
If I had the expertise, I would explain it here (or
rather, in rgc.computers) for you. To put things
into perspective, back in the 1980s there were
tabletop chess computers which would give the
current GetClub program a run for its money
despite their having unimaginably little memory
and speed by today's standards. This was the
jump to light speed we humans had been waiting
for.
-- help bot
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Date: 01 Dec 2007 21:38:58
From: Sanny
Subject: Re: GetClub Chess further improved.
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On Dec 1, 11:20 am, help bot <[email protected] > wrote:
> On Nov 30, 6:09 am, Sanny <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > PlayChessat:http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
>
> > Now it will think much deeper. And only the Beginner Level will play a
> > simple game. Higher Level will play much stronger.
>
> As far as I can see, whatever level I'm playing now
> is unbeatable (and undrawable, and unloseable); I
> still have just a King, versus a King and Knight, and
> the program still refuses to move, out of sheer
> stubbornness. I have the King cut off, and the Knight
> is on the run; it's only a matter of time before I get to
> one or the other; you can run, but you can't hide.
>
You only have a King, Then you have to press the Resign Button as
there is no way out.
Bye
Sanny
Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
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Date: 01 Dec 2007 21:37:53
From: Sanny
Subject: Re: GetClub Chess further improved.
|
On Nov 30, 5:26 pm, help bot <[email protected] > wrote:
> On Nov 30, 6:09 am, Sanny <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >GetClubGame was further improved. The old trick that nomorechess
> > suggested is not working as it lost 5/5 games. It lost to stykumb who
> > was unable to win earlier. So that improvement has been removed.
>
> That "trick", as Sanny calls it, is standard practice in all
> decentchessprograms since the middle ages; whenever
> there is a check or a capture, the search is deepened
> until a quiet position is reached (or at least until a certain
> cutoff depth) to enable more accurate calculation of
> exchanges and mating attacks.
Yes your technique is good but the way my programmers implemented it
reduced its depth to 2 level deep. So When there is a move with no
Check/ Capture it played the moves with just 2 level depth. and it
lost all the matches it played.
Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
Now it has been removed. And it will be done soon again with better
technique. as current implementation made it play very bad.
>
> Implemented *correctly*, this technique I would expect
> adds hundreds of rating points worth in tactical strength;
> done wrong, it is impossible to determine the potential
> damage. You see, unlike stupidity, genius has its
> limits.
>
> -- help bot
Play a few games with Easy & Normal Level & see if it needs Check &
Capture. If yes then it will be again added but this time using a new
method that will not reduce its depth of search.
Bye
Sanny
Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
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Date: 30 Nov 2007 22:20:05
From: help bot
Subject: Re: GetClub Chess further improved.
|
On Nov 30, 6:09 am, Sanny <[email protected] > wrote:
> Play Chess at:http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
>
> Now it will think much deeper. And only the Beginner Level will play a
> simple game. Higher Level will play much stronger.
As far as I can see, whatever level I'm playing now
is unbeatable (and undrawable, and unloseable); I
still have just a King, versus a King and Knight, and
the program still refuses to move, out of sheer
stubbornness. I have the King cut off, and the Knight
is on the run; it's only a matter of time before I get to
one or the other; you can run, but you can't hide.
-- killer bot
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Date: 30 Nov 2007 04:26:05
From: help bot
Subject: Re: GetClub Chess further improved.
|
On Nov 30, 6:09 am, Sanny <[email protected] > wrote:
> GetClub Game was further improved. The old trick that nomorechess
> suggested is not working as it lost 5/5 games. It lost to stykumb who
> was unable to win earlier. So that improvement has been removed.
That "trick", as Sanny calls it, is standard practice in all
decent chess programs since the middle ages; whenever
there is a check or a capture, the search is deepened
until a quiet position is reached (or at least until a certain
cutoff depth) to enable more accurate calculation of
exchanges and mating attacks.
Implemented *correctly*, this technique I would expect
adds hundreds of rating points worth in tactical strength;
done wrong, it is impossible to determine the potential
damage. You see, unlike stupidity, genius has its
limits.
-- help bot
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