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Date: 19 Sep 2006 10:15:15
From: Dave (from the UK)
Subject: Commonts appreciated on this loss.
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Someone on ICC offered to play me an unrated game and then to analyse it
later. I thought the outcome would be pretty obvious, given he was rated
almost 400 points higher than me, but what did I have to loose? He
played the opening quite poorly I felt, but in the middle game he
slaltered me. It never really reached an endgame - I'd resigned before
that point.
I'd be interested in the comments of others on this game. There are some
comments from myself, my opponent and 'chesscoach' on ICC.
I'm particularly interested on comments about the move 13...g6 which I
played. It obvioulsly felt right at the time to me, and later my
opponent said he felt it was right too. But I've been having some
lessons with 'chesscoach' on ICC and he feels it was a very poor move.
[Event "ICC 30 12 u"]
[Site "Internet Chess Club"]
[Date "2006.09.18"]
[Round "-"]
[White "IslandRhino"]
[Black "g8wrb"]
[Result "1-0"]
[WhiteElo "1675"]
[BlackElo "1289"]
[ECO "E20"]
[ICCResult "Black resigns"]
[Opening "Nimzo-Indian defense"]
[NIC "NI.30"]
[Time "16:27:11"]
[GameType "ICCStandard"]
[TimeControl "1800+12"]
1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Bb4
{Standard Nimzo Indian Defence. }
4.Bd2
{This is a very uncommon 4th move for White. In fact, from a
database of some 150,000 GM games, this only occureed on 0.4% of the time.
The Rubinstein System 4.e3 (named after Akiba Rubinstein) is
White's most common method of combating the Nimzo-Indian. White
continues his development before committing to a definite plan of action.
Most common White fourth moves are (in order of popularity in my
database of high level games):
* 4.e3 (50.5%) - Rubinstein System
* 4.Qc2 (25.1%) - The Classical or Capablanca Variation
* 4.Nf3 (7.7%) - The Kasparov Variation
* 4.a3 (4.2%) - The S�misch Variation
* 4.Bg5 (4.1%) - The Leningrad Variation received its name because
its theory was developed extensively by players from that city,
* 4.f3 (3.6%) - This is sometimes called the Gheorghiu Variation (a
name given by Gligoric), and sometimes the Shirov Variation, after
Alexei Shirov
* 4.Qb3 (2.0%) - The Spielmann Variation,
* 4.g3 (1.9%) - The Romanishin Variation
* 4.Bg2 (0.4%)
* 4.Qd3 (0. 0%)
}
4...O-O 5.e4??
{Blunder - e4 pawn is lost for no compensation. }
5...Bxc3 6.Bxc3 Nxe4 7.Bd3 Nxc3
{Doubles Whites pawns, whilst removing him of the bishop pair. }
8.bxc3 Qe7?
{This does not address the problem Black has, which is the fact the
bishop on c6 is taking no part in the game.
After much deliberation, Don (chesscoach on ICC), felt that 8...c5
was the best move, although this does give a pawn to white, although in
taking it his own pawns would be trippled and so white should not want that.
Another option was 8...d6, which would have prepared for ...e5 so
freeing the bishop on c6.
'crafty' also thought 8..c5 was the best move here, although it too
kept changing its mind on the issue as the search depth was increased.
}
9.Ne2
{White should have probably exploited the poor move 8...Qe2 by
playing 9.c5. That would have meant it would be impossible for Black to
make any use of the bishop without giving white the opportunity to
undouble his doubled pawns on the c-file. }
9...c5
{Good move, just played far too late. }
10.O-O Nc6 11.Re1 Qf6 12.Rc1 d6
{Aware I need to get my bishop into the game, I advance the d-pawn. }
13.Qd2 g6?
{Don thought this was poor, as it created two holes, which are
permanent structural weaknesses.
My logic for playing it was to avoid a bishop sacrifice on h7, but
Don felt this was not sound. Interestingly my opponent did think this
was the right move to play, but Don (chesscoach on ICC) disagrees. }
14.Be4 e5
{This is a very weak pawn structure with the backward d4 pawn }
15.Bxc6
{The computer program also thought this move the best. }
15...bxc6
{Obvious recapture, which doubled my pawns.
Crafty gives this a score of -0.46 and thinks white should play
16.dxc5}
16.d5
{Interestingly crafty thinks White should have played 16.dxc5
rather than 16.d5
Crafty thinks the advantage for Black has increased significantly
due to this.
Score is -1.06 at a search depth of 14}
16...cxd5
{crafty thinks white should have played the move 17.cxd5 rather
than the 17.Qxd5 which white played. That seems odd, since it would have
prevented the attack white made on the d6 pawn.
Perhaps the computer is wrong on this?
Perhaps with better play on my part, this was not so.
}
17.Qxd5
{crafty gives this as -1.53 at a search depth of 14. It thinks
black should play Rb8, which is what I played. }
17...Rb8 18.Ng3 Bb7!
{Attacks queen and puts the bishop on the good diagonal. Crafty
felt this too, and puts the score at -1.58 at a depth of 13, so black
has a decent advantage now. }
19.Qd2 Ba6?
{I did this to attack the static target - the c4 pawn. But Don and
crafty both think this was a poor move. Don points out that I've given
up the long a8 to h1 diagonal whilst attacking a pawn I have no
immediate hope of winning.
crafty says Qe6 would have been best, which would have still
attacked the pawn on c4, but would have not given up the long diagonal
the bishop had.
score is -0.42 at a depth of 16, which has worsened from its
previous value of }
20.Ne4 Qh4?? 21.Qxd6
{My opponent felt at this point he knew he was winning. Crafty
thinks to too, making the score +1.13 at a depth of 13 - the first time
white has had a significant advantage at any point in this game. }
21...Bxc4?
{Another poor move on my part. I should have done more to protect
my remaining central pawns (crafty thinks Rb6 should have been played).
Sore is +1.97 now, so very much in Whites favor. }
22.Qxe5 Bxa2
{Grabs an insigificant pawn, ignoring the threat of Nf6+!!
}
23.Nf6+
{Black resigns
score is +7.36}
1-0
--
Dave (from the UK)
Please note my email address changes periodically to avoid spam.
It is always of the form: [email protected]
Hitting reply will work for a few months only - later set it manually.
http://witm.sourceforge.net/ (Web based Mathematica front end)
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Date: 19 Sep 2006 17:23:03
From: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Commonts appreciated on this loss.
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Dave (from the UK) wrote:
> To be fair, only because of his blunder - not particularly good play by me.
You didn't blunder, but your opponent did. That's good play by you. :)
>>23.Nf6+
>> {Black resigns
> > Why? You're not playing a computer--it's very likely White would have
> > goofed. Eg, 23...Kh8 24.Nd7+ f6! and White ends up only one pawn ahead.
> > If you ended up a rook down, resign then, but at least wait 3-4 moves
> > to see what White's planning.
> Yes, perhaps I should have hung on a bit, but realistically if I'd even
> gone a pawn down, with my kingside the way it was, I had little real
> hope of pulling out even a draw.
Really? If White plays the "tempting" 24.Nd7+ then:
23...Kh8 24.Nd7+? f6 25.Qxc5 Rbc8 26.Qxa7 Rf7 27.Qxa2 Rxd7
Can White win this position *easily*? I doubt it, especially at the
amateur level. Here was my attempt to win this endgame against Crafty:
28. Qe6 Rcd8 29. g3 Qg5 30. h4 Qf5 31. Qxf5 gxf5 32. Re6 Kg7 33. c4 Rc8
34. c5 Rdc7 35. c6 Kf7 36. Rd6 Ke7 37. Rcd1 h6 38. Rd7+ Rxd7 39. Rxd7+
Ke6 40. Rh7 Rxc6 41. Rxh6 f4 42. Kg2 Kf5 43. Kh3 fxg3 44. fxg3 Rc1 45.
Kg2 Rc2+ 46. Kf3 Rc3+ 47. Kg2 Rc2+ 48. Kh3 Rc1 49. Kg2 Rc2+ 50. Kh3 Rc1
51. g4+ Ke5 52. g5 fxg5 53. hxg5 Kf5 54. Kg2 Kxg5 1/2-1/2
> Perhaps in future I will hang on for a couple of moves, just to see if
> my opponent plays as well as he could.
If he won your rook, I wouldn't ask why you resigned. But you have good
drawing chances when you're only 1-2 pawns or an exchange down.
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Date: 19 Sep 2006 13:59:05
From: David Richerby
Subject: Re: Commonts appreciated on this loss.
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Dave (from the UK) <[email protected] > wrote:
> [Event "ICC 30 12 u"]
> [Site "Internet Chess Club"]
> [Date "2006.09.18"]
> [Round "-"]
> [White "IslandRhino"]
> [Black "g8wrb"]
> [Result "1-0"]
>
> 1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Bb4 4.Bd2 O-O 5.e4?? Bxc3 6.Bxc3 Nxe4 7.Bd3
> Nxc3 8.bxc3 Qe7?
> {This does not address the problem Black has, which is the fact the
> bishop on c6 is taking no part in the game.
>
> After much deliberation, Don (chesscoach on ICC), felt that 8...c5
> was the best move [...] }
Your notes need to reflect the subtlety that 8... c5 is there so that
you can later develop the Bc8 without letting White undouble his
pawns.
> 9.Ne2 c5 10.O-O Nc6 11.Re1 Qf6 12.Rc1 d6
> {Aware I need to get my bishop into the game, I advance the d-pawn. }
Isn't the point here that 12... b6, while a more direct way of
developing the bishop, actually looks dubious because of 13.d5
followed by an annoying pawn on d6 ?
> 13.Qd2 g6?
> {Don thought this was poor, as it created two holes, which are
> permanent structural weaknesses.
>
> My logic for playing it was to avoid a bishop sacrifice on h7, but
> Don felt this was not sound. Interestingly my opponent did think
> this was the right move to play, but Don (chesscoach on ICC)
> disagrees. }
Why are you scared of a bishop sac on h7? White has absolutely
nothing to follow it up with. If the knight were on f3, you'd have to
consider Bxh7 Kxh7 Ng5+ but the knight isn't on f3.
> 14.Be4 e5
> {This is a very weak pawn structure with the backward d4 pawn }
Disagree. The pawn structure right now is fine. Backward pawns
aren't much of a problem on closed files. (BTW, you mean `d6 pawn'.)
> 15.Bxc6 bxc6 16.d5
To 17 ply, Fritz 8 has a slight preference for 16.dxe5 and 16.dxc5
(-0.22) over 16.Ng3 (-0.25). After 16.d5, it reckons 16... Ba6
17.dxc6 Bxc4, with d5 to follow (-1.09/16). (I looked into this
because I mistook crafty's recommendation of 17.cxd5 as one for
16.cxd5.
> 16... cxd5
> {crafty thinks white should have played the move 17.cxd5 rather than
> the 17.Qxd5 which white played. That seems odd, since it would have
> prevented the attack white made on the d6 pawn.
>
> Perhaps the computer is wrong on this? [...] }
Computers aren't always right. And, even when they are right, the
move recommended isn't necessarily best for you. Crafty probably
thinks that it can defend accurately against 17.Qxd5, even though the
pawn structure is horrible; Fritz agrees with Crafty. I think 17.Qxd5
is definitely the right move for a human to play because it creates
all sorts of problems for Black who's sure to make a mistake before
too long.
> 17.Qxd5
Now, *this* is a very weak pawn structure with the backward d6 pawn.
It's blockaded and on an open file.
> 17...Rb8 18.Ng3 Bb7! 19.Qd2 Ba6?
This can't be right and you can determine this by logic as much as by
chess. First, if it was right, you should have played it last move.
(Of course, it could be that 18... Bb7 was a mistake so you shouldn't
discard the move for this reason alone). Second, it invites the draw
by repetition (20.Qd5 Bb7 21.Qd2 etc.) -- is that really what you want
in this position?
> 20.Ne4 Qh4?? 21.Qxd6 Bxc4? 22.Qxe5 Bxa2 23.Nf6+ 1-0
Dave.
--
David Richerby Carnivorous Priest (TM): it's like a
www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~davidr/ man of the cloth but it eats flesh!
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Date: 19 Sep 2006 05:08:49
From: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Commonts appreciated on this loss.
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Dave (from the UK) wrote:
> 8.bxc3 Qe7?
> {This does not address the problem Black has, which is the fact the
> bishop on c6 is taking no part in the game.
>
> After much deliberation, Don (chesscoach on ICC), felt that 8...c5
> was the best move, although this does give a pawn to white, although in
> taking it his own pawns would be trippled and so white should not want that.
This is not "the problem" for Black. Black has several problems: (1) he
has less space, (2) he has less open lines, (3) his kingside has no
protector. He also has the advantage of being a pawn up, of course!
I don't think the "best" move is so important here. Having a reasonable
development plan, on the other hand, is important. Qe7 doesn't fit into
any plan.
For example, 8...d5 9.Nf3 dxc4 10.Bxc4 Nd7 11.O-O Nf6 12.b6 Bb7 is
good. Alternately, 8...d6 9.Nf3 e5 10.Bg4 Bxf3 11.Qxf3 Nc6 is also
good.
> 13.Qd2 g6?
> {Don thought this was poor, as it created two holes, which are
> permanent structural weaknesses.
Yes. If your dark-squared bishop were still in play, this would not be
a concern.
> My logic for playing it was to avoid a bishop sacrifice on h7, but
Why do you want to avoid Bxh7? Look at it tactically--will he win? No.
So that means it would be a mistake giving you a huge (winning)
material advantage. Also, if you transfer the knight to f6 per the
first development plan I mentioned you protect h7 without ruining your
pawn structure.
> 20.Ne4 Qh4?? 21.Qxd6
> {My opponent felt at this point he knew he was winning. Crafty
> thinks to too, making the score +1.13 at a depth of 13 - the first time
> white has had a significant advantage at any point in this game. }
White definitely had an advantage, but Black could still draw.
> 21...Bxc4?
> Sore is +1.97 now, so very much in Whites favor. }
White can score a passed pawn or the exchange. That may be a winning
advantage, or it may not be depending how well you know your endgames.
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Date: 19 Sep 2006 04:37:44
From: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Commonts appreciated on this loss.
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Hi Dave,
I analyzed your game without reading your comments, because I didn't
want them to influence my own thoughts.
Dave (from the UK) wrote:
> 1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Bb4
Nimzo-Indian.
> 4.Bd2 O-O 5.e4 Bxc3 6.Bxc3 Nxe4 7.Bd3 Nxc3 8.bxc3
I like. You're up a pawn and your opponent has doubled pawns. All you
have to do now is develop, protect your king, and exchange into a
favorable endgame. However, your opponent has space, open lines, and a
bishop pointed at your kingside so you're not going to have *that* easy
a time.
> 8...Qe7 9.Ne2 c5 10.O-O Nc6 11.Re1 Qf6 12.Rc1 d6 13.Qd2
Qe7 is a wasted tempo, since you played Qf6 later.
I don't see Nc6 as a good square for your knight since White's c3-pawn
guards all the places it wants to jump to. I think Nd7- >f6 or Nd7->b6
are better.
> 13...g6?
Poor. You've made h6 and f6 vulnerable, which could become good
outposts for his knight and queen to deliver mate or otherwise threaten
your forces.
> 14.Be4 e5
You've made d5 vulnerable, which could become an outpost for his
knight. However, you have a light-squared bishop that can defend the
square, so it's not a big problem.
> 15.Bxc6 bxc6 16.d5 cxd5 17.Qxd5 Rb8 18.Ng3 Bb7
Bb7 is good. You stop his queen from using the d5 outpost. However,
your d4-square is looking very weak now and needs protection.
> 19.Qd2 Ba6
Oops. Now, he's got an attack on d4.
> 20.Ne4 Qh4 21.Qxd6
Now your c- and f-pawns are in trouble, but his a- and c4-pawns are
hanging, so you have a good shot at a draw. Watch your f6- and
h6-squares.
> 21...Bxc4 22.Qxe5 Bxa2
What?! Don't you see the threat? After Nf6+, you'll have to move your
king to g7 or h8, setting up a discovered attack?! He could land mate,
a rook, or the exchange.
> 23.Nf6+
> {Black resigns
Why? You're not playing a computer--it's very likely White would have
goofed. Eg, 23...Kh8 24.Nd7+ f6! and White ends up only one pawn ahead.
If you ended up a rook down, resign then, but at least wait 3-4 moves
to see what White's planning.
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Date: 19 Sep 2006 13:46:18
From: Dave (from the UK)
Subject: Re: Commonts appreciated on this loss.
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[email protected] wrote:
> Hi Dave,
>
> I analyzed your game without reading your comments, because I didn't
> want them to influence my own thoughts.
Thanks, a good idea I guess.
>
> Dave (from the UK) wrote:
>
>
>>1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Bb4
>
>
> Nimzo-Indian.
>
>>4.Bd2 O-O 5.e4 Bxc3 6.Bxc3 Nxe4 7.Bd3 Nxc3 8.bxc3
>
>
> I like. You're up a pawn and your opponent has doubled pawns.
To be fair, only because of his blunder - not particularly good play by me.
> All you
> have to do now is develop, protect your king, and exchange into a
> favorable endgame. However, your opponent has space, open lines, and a
> bishop pointed at your kingside so you're not going to have *that* easy
> a time.
I realised it would not be easy. Especially since he is a much stronger
play (some 400 points higher on ICC).
>
>>8...Qe7 9.Ne2 c5 10.O-O Nc6 11.Re1 Qf6 12.Rc1 d6 13.Qd2
>
>
> Qe7 is a wasted tempo, since you played Qf6 later.
My plan on Qe7 was to later play c5. But this does look to have been
unsound.
> I don't see Nc6 as a good square for your knight since White's c3-pawn
> guards all the places it wants to jump to. I think Nd7->f6 or Nd7->b6
> are better.
>
>
>>13...g6?
>
>
> Poor. You've made h6 and f6 vulnerable, which could become good
> outposts for his knight and queen to deliver mate or otherwise threaten
> your forces.
Yes, realise that now. I did wonder this at the time. You are the second
person to think it was unsound. Strangely my opponent thought it was
right - despite the fact the weakness created led to my loss.
>>14.Be4 e5
>
>
> You've made d5 vulnerable, which could become an outpost for his
> knight. However, you have a light-squared bishop that can defend the
> square, so it's not a big problem.
>
>
>>15.Bxc6 bxc6 16.d5 cxd5 17.Qxd5 Rb8 18.Ng3 Bb7
>
>
> Bb7 is good. You stop his queen from using the d5 outpost. However,
> your d4-square is looking very weak now and needs protection.
>
>
>>19.Qd2 Ba6
>
>
> Oops. Now, he's got an attack on d4.
I realise that was poor now.
>
>>20.Ne4 Qh4 21.Qxd6
>
>
> Now your c- and f-pawns are in trouble, but his a- and c4-pawns are
> hanging, so you have a good shot at a draw. Watch your f6- and
> h6-squares.
>
>>21...Bxc4 22.Qxe5 Bxa2
>
>
> What?! Don't you see the threat? After Nf6+, you'll have to move your
> king to g7 or h8, setting up a discovered attack?! He could land mate,
> a rook, or the exchange.
Tunnle vision I guess. Knowing he was taking my pawns, but aware I could
take his, and not looking at all the threats he could make.
>>23.Nf6+
>> {Black resigns
>
>
> Why? You're not playing a computer--it's very likely White would have
> goofed. Eg, 23...Kh8 24.Nd7+ f6! and White ends up only one pawn ahead.
> If you ended up a rook down, resign then, but at least wait 3-4 moves
> to see what White's planning.
Yes, perhaps I should have hung on a bit, but realistically if I'd even
gone a pawn down, with my kingside the way it was, I had little real
hope of pulling out even a draw.
Perhaps in future I will hang on for a couple of moves, just to see if
my opponent plays as well as he could.
--
Dave (from the UK)
Please note my email address changes periodically to avoid spam.
It is always of the form: [email protected]
Hitting reply will work for a few months only - later set it manually.
http://witm.sourceforge.net/ (Web based Mathematica front end)
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Date: 19 Sep 2006 15:17:33
From: David Richerby
Subject: Re: Commonts appreciated on this loss.
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Dave (from the UK) <[email protected] > wrote:
> [email protected] wrote:
>> Poor. You've made h6 and f6 vulnerable, which could become good
>> outposts for his knight and queen to deliver mate or otherwise
>> threaten your forces.
>
> Yes, realise that now. I did wonder this at the time. You are the
> second person to think it was unsound. Strangely my opponent thought
> it was right - despite the fact the weakness created led to my loss.
I expect this means your opponent was fantasizing about a Bxh7
sacrifice at some point. But, at the point where you played ...g6,
a successful Bxh7 was nothing more than a fantasy.
Dave.
--
David Richerby Evil Beefy Priest (TM): it's like a
www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~davidr/ man of the cloth that's made from a
cow but it's genuinely evil!
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